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Message started by oderr on Jun 2nd, 2012 at 1:58am

Title: 1895 Carbine
Post by oderr on Jun 2nd, 2012 at 1:58am
I recently purchased a 1895 Krag with a serial number 27791.  Is there a way to tell if this serial number is a carbine?   Also, it has a slide on the left hand side but no ring.  Did the 1895 carbine come with a ring and is there a good website to find pictures of the 1895 carbine?
Thank you.

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by Top Dean on Jun 2nd, 2012 at 10:33am
This is one of the best web sites there is for the Krag. There are pictures posted on the Home page of the different Carbines.by your serial number yours was assembeled in May of 1896, and by your serial number your Carbine should be a Model 1896 not a 1895. some pictures of you weapon would help. and you would also need to measure your barrel by inserting a cleaning rod down the barrel with the bolt closed. Mark the rod where the end of the barrel is and it should be 22 inches. Like yours my Carbine also has the plate on the site but not Saddle ring Bar or Ring. I am not sure if this was done at a Depo or what as Mine is the only one that I have seen like this.

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by 98src on Jun 2nd, 2012 at 11:14am
Although your serial number is not listed in SRS data, it is very likely a carbine since the number is well within a known group of M1896 Carbines. Good pictures of the Model year marking would help.

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by oderr on Jun 3rd, 2012 at 2:44am
I measured the inside of the barrel with the bolt closed and I get a measurement of 21.5".  The receiver is definitely marked 1895 and it has a bar with no saddle ring.
Thanks

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by Dick Hosmer on Jun 3rd, 2012 at 4:22pm
The item under discussion is often called the "1895 Variant" of the Model 1896 Carbine.

The initial production run of the Krag was about 24500 Model 1892 Rifles. Nearly all are marked "1894". The first carbines, and a very few rifles, and probably the elusive 400 Cadet Rifles, are marked "1895". The "1894"/"1895" marking change, at around 24000, is not tidy, and overlaps have been reported.

The marking was changed to "1896" at around 32000. Both rifles and carbines are found with this marking, which is the least common of the datings. The stamp did not change to "Model 1896" until around 37100. The arms themselves were apparently called Model 1896s before the marking was actually applied.

The 21.5" barrel measurement, if accurate, is disturbing, and indicates some sort of cutting off from the normal 22". Pictures of the gun would help.

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by oderr on Jun 4th, 2012 at 2:29am
Thank you for the information.  I will have to take some pictures. 

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by oderr on Jun 4th, 2012 at 11:05pm
Attached are some photos of the 1895 Carbine.  Please let me know if more would be helpful.
Thank you.
CIMG2639.JPG ( 172 KB | 1 Download )
CIMG2635.JPG ( 148 KB | 0 Downloads )
CIMG2633.JPG ( 129 KB | 0 Downloads )
CIMG2631.JPG ( 161 KB | 0 Downloads )
CIMG2626.JPG ( 150 KB | 0 Downloads )

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by butlersrangers on Jun 4th, 2012 at 11:48pm
oderr:  I think you might have a carbine barrel that was shortened at the breech end, re-chambered, and then screwed into your action.  The front sight looks correct, but your barrel is too short.  Your rear sight (although an incorrect 1892 rifle sight) should not have that large gap between it and the sight guard barrel-band.  You appear to have an 1896 Carbine Stock & hand-guard.  It would be interesting to see a photo without the hand-guard.  This would show how the barrel taper matches up with the barrel channel in the stock and the front of the receiver ring.

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by Dick Hosmer on Jun 5th, 2012 at 12:52am
I've seen some strange things, but I must say that I've never seen that before!!

B/R's answer is spot on.

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by Century2 on Jun 5th, 2012 at 12:11pm
Is it still chambered for the 30-40 cartridge?

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by butlersrangers on Jun 5th, 2012 at 8:17pm
Good question, Century.  I was wondering that too.

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by oderr on Jun 5th, 2012 at 10:03pm
Thank you for all the info.  I will have to check that out.

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by Top Dean on Jun 6th, 2012 at 9:16pm
You have stated that the barrel is only 21.5 inches well it looks like from the picturea and the data we have that for some reason the barrel was shortend from the breach as the sight seems to be back 1/2 of a inch. how far from the muzzel is the front of the rear site with that measurement and then measure fromt the front of the reat sight to where the bolt face is when closed this may help answer a few questions and raise a few more.

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by reincarnated on Jun 7th, 2012 at 12:02am
Could it have been converted into a 30-30?

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by psteinmayer on Jun 7th, 2012 at 1:13am
I was wondering about 303...  The head and rim size is similary to the 30-40, which would fit to the bolt.  I just don't understand why anyone would rechamber.  Doesn't the 30-30 have a smaller diameter rim?

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by Top Dean on Jun 7th, 2012 at 3:09am
I dont think it is 303 as i just took a round of 303 and it with in the rifle as it was made for it, I dont have any of my reloading books in the house right now so 30-30 might be about right but 303 is almost if not the same length at this point and my 30-40 rounds are not in the house eiths to compair with, if I remember i will go pull a round of each and check them for length

Title: Re: 1895 Carbine
Post by reincarnated on Jun 7th, 2012 at 5:30am
Most sporter versions of the US Krag are just shortened rifles or altered carbines, perhaps with some extensive stock work, but with issue barrels. 

There are other versions with slightly altered actions, usually a modification to allow slightly longer cartridges to feed through the magazine.  I have seen these in .35 WCF and .405 WCF.  These have completely new barrels and usually new stocks. 

Probably the most common non-30/40 version was rebarreling to .25/35 Winchester.  The Krag action fed the 25/35 case with no alterations necessary.  Since the 25/35 works in the action, the other bottleneck cartridges based on the same case (30/30, etc) should also feed well.  These can be found with either new stocks or just worked-over military stocks.  These conversions were made because many hunters considered the 30/40 cartridge to be excessively powerful.

Krag actions were also used to make .219 Zipper, .22 Hornet & variants, .22 Savage HP, and .25 Krag varmint rifles.  All those are usually found as single shots, and usually with new stocks.

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