Krag Collectors Association Forum Archive
General >> Older threads >> A simple poll
http://www.kragcollectorsassociation.org/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1338634861

Message started by Brently on Jun 2nd, 2012 at 11:01am

Title: A simple poll
Post by Brently on Jun 2nd, 2012 at 11:01am
Is re-bluing an 1898 ethical ?

Title: Re: A simple poll
Post by Dick Hosmer on Jun 2nd, 2012 at 3:55pm
The simple physical act of rebluing has little to do with ethics.

It is what happens to, or is done with, the rifle afterwards, where the ethics issue arises. Since we cannot take our toys to the afterlife, the "personal property - I'll do what I f-well please" argument holds no water, at all.

If the arm is in 100% military configuration, but in less than pristine condition, then I think most people would agree that it should be left alone.

If it has been brutally bubbacized, then I would think that few people would care.

Title: Re: A simple poll
Post by Top Dean on Jun 2nd, 2012 at 6:34pm
if you want to have a pretty looking rifle, then do it, but if in the future you were to want to sell it or trade it its value would be a lot less to a true collector.

Title: Re: A simple poll
Post by reincarnated on Jun 2nd, 2012 at 7:49pm
Consider the rifle shown to us by Ljohns, today found 3 topics below this one.  Did many (or any) leave Springfield Armory with that sort of finish?  I would not say that none were made like that.  Some might have been given that treatment for ceremonial use or for VIPs or some such.  But we know that ordinary issue Krags did not look like that. 

To me, it looks like a very nice 1950s or 60s reblue & refinish job.  I would not advise someone with a nice original Krag to do that today.  But I am looking for a nice 98 rifle.  If that were offered for sale, I would buy it in a heartbeat at $500, but would not at twice that. 

I think you need to look at it in the context of our role as caretakers of this old stuff, and of potential markets & changing tastes for our heirs.  Right now, patina has a positive value for us, because we like Krags. At present, we seem to be using the "Antiques Roadshow" rules as applied to old furniture.

In 1958, markets & tastes were different. Ljohns rifle is representative of that period, as are the chrome plated Krags we have seen recently. 

Ignoring politics, what will the future hold for arms collectors?  How much of an influence on the collectors of the future will the "Restoration" TV shows have?  Would you prefer a rusty old Coke machine that leaks water and maybe does not work or one with shiny red paint, the leaks plugged, and a working refrigeration unit? 

Title: Re: A simple poll
Post by butlersrangers on Jun 2nd, 2012 at 11:09pm
Most refinishing techniques seldom enhance or look right on classic sporting and military firearms.  Modern Bluing simply does not match any of the varied finishes that appeared on an original Krag (i.e. rust browning/bluing of the barrel, flame bluing found on extractor, safety, and cutoff, and case-colors found on action).  "Patina" is not new or trendy to gun collectors.  Preserving what is left of the original finish has been the tradition for centuries of collectors.  Polishing and buffing metal parts destroys the shape of parts with dips, ripples, and rounded edges.  There are patient top-notch restorers but their work is extremely expensive and seldom utilized on military pieces produced in large numbers.  In fact, the price of a restored Krag would probably exceed the value of an original in very good or fine condition (and it would be 'refinished').  As Madfarmers recently pointed out, Antique Guns are treated much like collectible coins;  you don't buff and polish them.  We all probably enjoy a beautifully restored vintage car.  But, some are poorly done.  Sometimes you see a car that is all original, cared for and not restored or rebuilt.  It would seem 'criminal' to destroy that car's originality by making it look new.  It is a rare and beautiful thing!

Title: Re: A simple poll
Post by Dick Hosmer on Jun 3rd, 2012 at 5:40am
The point about the Coke machine is well-taken - and, I have zero qualms about coming to the instant conclusion that there is NO question but that, in that case, as well as cars, that I would prefer the restoration, hands down.

I cannot find the words to describe the "difference", but, to me, there is a definite difference, between modern utilitarian items, and objects with a "history".

Title: Re: A simple poll
Post by docbob on Jun 3rd, 2012 at 9:03pm
I'll take an old original with 20% original finish over one that has had all it's history polished away. We've all seen a lot of beautification projects that aren't all that beautiful.

Title: Re: A simple poll
Post by psteinmayer on Jun 3rd, 2012 at 11:08pm
I agree 100% too!  There is a huge difference between a restored car with a higher resale value than a rust bucket... and a 1898 rifle with deep un-natural bluing and no original finnish.  I'll take the un-restored rifle any day and twice on Sunday!!!

Krag Collectors Association Forum Archive » Powered by YaBB 2.6.0!
YaBB Forum Software © 2000-2026. All Rights Reserved.