I'm looking at a M'98 w/Italian Walnut stock, 1903 cartouche, very good condition.
Only "downer" is . . . . it's wearing a M'92 rear sight (and hand guard).
What are the chances of this combo being correct/original? Pretty slim, eh?
The hand guard sure looks original to the rifle as it is also of Italian Walnut.
TIA, --Jim

Welcome to the KCA forum.  What is the serial number on the Model 1898 receiver?  Spgfield, as you state, those early parts cannot be correct on a rifle built in 1903.  1901 and 1902 rear sights and hand-guards are not difficult to find over time, but, expect to invest another $140.  However, you could recover most of that expense by selling off the earlier parts.  Maybe you can leverage the 'wrong' parts to get a better price.

Welcome!

Working off the top of my head here, which I should not do, but there was (per Mallory) at least one, presumably brief, period when M1892 sights were installed on current M1898 rifle production, due to a shortage of the current proper sight. I do think it was a bit earlier however; so, what is the serial number? That might tell us more than the stock date.

And a 96 sight will fit, using the same handguard and front sight blade.

I won't be able to see the rifle again until Wednesday, as the gun store is only open Wed. thru Sat.

I'm not even sure he will still have it, as it is in very good condition and should sell fast.

I will try to get the serial number . . . AND verify the handguard! My memory isn't the best anymore, so maybe it is a later handguard.

I can't imagine it being a legitimate m'92 guard, made of Italian Walnut.

TIA, --Jim

The Navy and Marines got a lot of the Italian stocked rifles, issued first with the 98 sight, then back to the 96 sight after the ammo the 98 sight was regulated for got recalled.  Like I said, the 96 and 92 sights take the same handguard.  Then there's what Dick mentioned.

The Italian walnut blanks (33,000 of them) were purchased in June & July, 1899, per Mallory.  Most of the ones I've seen have 1899 and 1900 'Cartouche' dates.  It is likely the hand guard on the rifle you are interested in is for an 1896 rifle sight which is easy to find.

butlersrangers wrote on Mar 3^rd, 2014 at 6:51pm:

The Italian walnut blanks (33,000 of them) were purchased in June & July, 1899, per Mallory.  Most of the ones I've seen have 1899 and 1900 'Cartouche' dates.  It is likely the hand guard on the rifle you are interested in is for an 1896 rifle sight which is easy to find.

Yes, the answer may be a simple as that the arm is A-OK, meant for an 1896 sight (also correct at certain times) but upon which someone "put" an 1892 sight because they "liked it"! All is not lost. But, if the hand-guard does not fit the rifle AND the sight like a glove, you have a huge red flag.

There's some dealers out there who "think" they know what sight should be on a rifle.  I sold a good barrel to an AF Lt Col who had bought a 98 that had the chamber all reamed out, and then someone tried putting an insert in it.  Anyway, he took it to a dealer and they wanted to cut his asking price way back because it had a 96 sight on it rather than a 1901 or 1902, like it wasn't original.  But his was in range where it was very likely it was issued with the 96 sight.  I was a little miffed at that Lt Col wishing to sell it, if I'd known he wasn't going to take it out and play with it I wouldn't have sold him the the only .308 groove diameter barrel I had at the time.  But I got over being miffed at him.  I've always had to keep my Lt Cols in line!

How did the insert work out? I have a pretty nice 30" barrel that some idiot "demilled" by reaming out the chamber area.

When Spgfield first described the Krag he is interested in, he said:  "it's wearing a M'92 rear sight and hand guard".  I had visions of it having a Model 1892 rifle hand guard as pictured on the KCA Website - photo page.  It sounds more likely that it actually has the Model 1896 type of hand guard.

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butlersrangers wrote on Mar 4^th, 2014 at 4:36pm:

. . . It sounds more likely that it actually has the Model 1896 type of hand guard.

Quite likely it IS a M'96 handguard . . . .

But . . . .

How likely would a M'96 handguard be made from Italian walnut?

Something doesn't gel here . . . .I'm wanting to get another look at it tomorrow!

I do want to thank everyone here for their interest in this! --Jim

Serial number range will tell a much.  Oddest thing, in my experience, is a 1903 acceptance 'Cartouche' on an Italian stock.  They are usually 1899 & 1900 from my observation, but then, I'm open to learning that I don't know a lot!  If its a really nice Krag and you can strike a good price, Buy It!  Put a readily available 1896 sight on it and you will be real happy.  (Keep the 1892 sight as a conversation piece).  I am sure I have seen Italian walnut hand guards for Model 1896, 1901 and 1898/1902 rear sights.

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Gunbroker has a Model 1898 Krag for sale with Italian wood and 1896 rear sight.  It is in the 294,000 range and has '1900' Cartouche.  Opening bid starting at $550.

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Dick the insert appeared to be steel just inserted. Actually the Lt Col posted pics of the sectioned barrel on Culvers.  It didn't work out, blew gas back through the action everytime he shot it.  Looked like a section of steel wedged into a barrel that had been demilled by hogging out the chamber, then the inserted steel chambered, with a big gap before the rifling started.  It shot real good after he put my barrel on it.

The answer to 1903 cartouched Italian walnut could be using up leftovers shortly before the end of production, or it could be the supplier brought more of the wood in at that time.

Some of those Italian stocks are mighty pretty.

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We'll gents . . . .

I returned to the store this afternoon to find that the rifle in question has been sold.

It was already gone when I got there, so I guess everything is now moot!

Ahh, we'll . . .

There are more "fish in the sea" out there, eh?

Again . . . Thanks for all your input on this . . . . --Jim

Sorry Jim.  Good luck in your quest.