iv got a krag here, unknown cal. or origin. its got swastikas on the barrel. The bore is dark, and seems warn. I got it in an auction, without being able to see the bore.

Its currently soaking in home Hoppes to try and clean out any of the old junk left in it. After a preliminary cleaning there was some serious carbon and black build up in the oil.

Can anyone comment on the bore of a well taken care of Krag, or even better have any pictures?

A few more things to add to my post.

The swastika is E (Swastika) 5 or F (Swastika) 5 and has a 14 blow it.

The serial numbers on the action, and the barrel match. as does the rear site assembly. The odd part about the rear sight... it graduates all the way up to 2200.. is this normal?

Apparently you have a Norwegian Krag, in 6.5mm, which was marked with the swastika during the Nazi occupation.

The swastika was also used as an identifying mark in Norway many years prior to the occupation. At the time it had no political significance. See post at   (You need to Login for this image in context -

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Note that this swastika's arms bend in the opposite direction of the Nazi symbol.

Hotwire:  Welcome to the KCA forum!
  Parashooter is knowledgeable and correct.  I believe that marking was used by the Norwegian steel or barrel supplier and it is commonly seen on early 'Konsberg Krags'.
  The 'swastika' was an ancient symbol used by many cultures.  Early books by Rudyard Kipling will have it beneath the author's name.  I have seen it on old American poker chips, a sign for 'Good Luck'.  I believe it was used by western 'Native Americans' and in India.  The Nazis ruined a perfectly good symbol!
  As Dick Hosmer related, your rifle is probably in 6.5X55mm 'Swedish Mauser'.  (The WW2 occupation Norwegian Krags will have the Nazi Eagle and swastika).
  It is hard to find Norwegian Krags with nice shiny bores.  The barrels have a left hand thread, so re-barreling would be a challenge.  Hopefully your bore 'cleans up'.  A good Norwegian bore would look like any other good bore.  In my experience, a rough 6.5mm bore will often cause heavy 160 grain bullets to tumble, but, may shoot 139 grain bullets very well.  Unaltered Norwegian Krags are a desirable rifle.  If you post pictures and a serial number, you will get more information.

I have several milsurp rifles - my Krag one of them - with dark and worn bores. I shoot cast bullets in them with great success. The key is to slug the bore and determine the best bullet size for your rifle. Typically, most find good success with bullets sized at or 0.001 over throat diameter. Also check the muzzle crown with a loop or magnifying glass. Even small imperfections can grossly affect accuracy. You are doing the right thing - clean 'er up and give it a try!

SO, today I was able to use some stainless steel wool, Hoppes #9, and scrub from chamber to muzzle like a fiend. It was coming out DARK GREY for a good 30 min. After it started to patch cleaner.. "Cleaner".. I slugged the barrel from muzzle to chamber.

I did 2 sluggings, both of them came out smooth, with no sign of rifling. how ever both of them measured in at .25615". so the land to land diameter is 6.506mm. The groove to groove should be 6.5mm-ish... should it not?

Ill have a picture up in a few, but maybe this bore is dirty as F*%K, and just has its grooves FULL of junk? Im going to try fire-lapping.

Fire lapping is a last step, taken in desperation, with no going back. There are several things you can do before resorting to fire lapping.

First, stop using the stainless steel wool or any stainless steel bore brushes.  Those have wrecked a lot of otherwise OK barrels. If the grooves are packed, they are probably filled with some combination of dirt,dried-out oil & grease.  Get a sturdy cleaning rod and several good bronze wire bore brushes in the .27 to .30 size.  Start from the breech and scrub the barrel dozens of times.  Follow that with some patches.

To go further, take the barreled action out of the stock.  Things will get messy.

Next, fit a rubber stopper in the muzzle and fill the barrel with some good penetrating oil or grease-cutting solvent.  Prop the rifle up vertically and let it sit for a day or 2.  Then repeat the bore brush & cleaning patches routine.

Next, find one of those electrolytic cleaning sets.  Put the rubber stopper back in the muzzle and fill the barrel with ammonia. Household NH4OH works, commercial grades work better.  The electrolytic cleaner has an iron rod with a couple of rubber o-rings to keep it from touching the barrel. Use a DC low voltage power source, probably from some old electronic gizmo that failed long ago.  Use alligator clips.  Hook one wire to the iron rod and the other to the barrel.  The idea is to plate the iron rod with all the crap adhering to the inside of the barrel or get the crap suspended in the ammonia solution.  Allow the current to run for 10 minutes or less.  Drain out the ammonia.  Repeat until the ammonia comes out relatively clean. If this does not seem to be working,try reversing the leads.

After that, you need to neutralize the ammonia.  I fill the teakettle with water, bring it to a boil, and slowly pour the water down the barrel, from the breech to the muzzle.

Then go back to the bore brushes and patches.  By now, the barrel might be as clean as it is going to get.

Ran out of characters.  Here is more.  Now you should be able to slug the barrel and get the groove diameter.  Run a couple of oily patches through the bore.  The lead slug needs some lubricant. The slug must be big enough to completely fill the grooves, which will (with luck) measure about 0.264". 

When I slug an old military rifle in6.5 or 7 mm, I start with a .36 caliber lead ball for a percussion revolver.  Oil the ball and start it in the muzzle.  I use a small brass hammer and tap the ball gently until it enters the muzzle.  Next, I use a piece of 1/4-inch brass rod stock about 4" long to push the slug a bit further into the barrel.  An old but sturdy cleaning rod should push the slug the rest of the way with little effort.  Push easily and note any places where the slug seems tight or loose.  Put a rag into the breech to catch the slug.  The slug should tell you how worn the barrel really is.

When you finish, you might use some minimally abrasive bore paste to smooth things up a bit.

My experience with old 6.5 & 7 mm military rifles is that they have quick twists and usually shoot jacketed bullets a lot better than cast. 

Thank you, more to follow.

Thank you for the inspiration, I built a electrolitic bore cleaner yesterday, using some welding rod, vulcanizing tape, and a trickle charger. I will be trying that out tonight. I have used water before for this purpose. some say distilled (Not very conductive at all), some say salt (Extremly conductive), you suggest amonia, Iv even heard of using windshield washer fluid (Its a cleaner, has amonia, and other elements as well). I will exparament tonight. I do belive the polarity matter big time. So I will do some more reading about that.

The twist in this is pretty agressive. I used a cylindrical slug that I had made using a drill sized too lard to fit in bore, and a block of oak. Drill the hole, melt the lead, pour some slugs. Soft face hammered it in, and used 6" sections of wood dowel to push it threw. It did get tighter as I progressed from muzzle to chambre. but that would be from the mushrooming of the slug as I pushed it threw. The material Im using to slug is commonly used for fishing weights.

The wire wool Im using is not stainless as I had stated, more of a flattened wire pot scrubber. If you know the style I mean. It rusts... rather quickly I might add. so Im not sure that its stainless, chromed, or what have you. But I will switch to some 000 Bulldog wire wool.

The fact that the slug was undersized, gives me hope, and inspiration to keep going. I will say that the lands were cleaned up quite well after my cleaning, and slugging. Now to get right into the grooves. Wish me luck, this is a nice rifle, and I want to keep it that way.

On a side note of its "Cleanliness" there are heavy deposits on the receiver. I had to use a dental pick to remove. I dont know how long it sat, or how long it went without cleaning... But it sure was abused and mistreated.

Again thank you for your suggestion.

Here are some photos from after I used the electrolysis cleaner I built. Its pretty rough.

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That does not look good.  It's time to try scrubbing with wire brushes, but that may not help.  What did you use for the conducting liquid?  Did you replace the liquid during the electrolysis?  What color was the liquid after treatment?

I did that to a Kropatschek fired with black powder & steel jacketed bullets and to a Siamese Mauser last cleaned 50+ years before.  In both cases, it took 3 10-minute treatments.  The liquid was nearly clear after the last treatment.  After all that, both rifles are capable of paper-plate accuracy at 100 yards, but will not hit anything smaller without a lot of luck.

Maybe it is time for test firing.  Try jacketed bullets first.

The bore was always that rough. How ever before doing the electrolysis treatment the rifling was way less evidentm the pitting was already there. I think that running some jacketed projectiles threw it may help. As may fire lapping. But I'm going to give it an other try tonight.

Back in the early 1960s, Navy Arms (Val Forgett) imported a bunch of Norse Krags & advertised them as having "salt & pepper" bores.  Their adverts said "where the salt did not pit, the pepper did".  Perhaps you have one.  Or perhaps yours is one with an even worse bore.

I do not think lining the bore is advisable with a high powered cartridge.  Is the rifle worth a new barrel?

I Like the Krag action, I would re barrel it, with a custom barrel and just reuse the action. More info on these salt and pepper rifles would be great.

I did not buy one.  Did any other Forum participant?  Does anyone have a late 1950s or early 1960s gun magazine with a "Ye Olde Hunter" advert?  If so, please scan & post.

Hotwire, you are in BC.  Where would you get a new barrel?

Another general question about Norse Krags: What are the dimensions of the barrel threads?  Would a good barrel from a Swedish Mauser fit? Could one be made to fit?

Caution - Norwegian Krag barrels have a Left-hand thread.

reincarnated wrote on Oct 29^th, 2014 at 1:29am:

I did not buy one.  Did any other Forum participant?  Does anyone have a late 1950s or early 1960s gun magazine with a "Ye Olde Hunter" advert?  If so, please scan & post. Hotwire, you are in BC.  Where would you get a new barrel? Another general question about Norse Krags: What are the dimensions of the barrel threads?  Would a good barrel from a Swedish Mauser fit? Could one be made to fit?

I could get a barrel blank in 6.5 x 55. Then Left hand thread it lol, and go about fitting it to the action. I wanted to keep the current barrel as its numbers match.

Or get it rebored, to a calibre in the same cartridge family, or even better bored and lined. AS for being in Canada, Were not without gunsmiths here... lol

My question about barrels was one of source.  I only know of 2 Canadian barrel makers.  Both cater to the high-end custom gun trade & both probably have lists with enough customers-in-waiting to keep them busy for the rest of their lives.

Ah, yes, I understand now. That is something Ill have to look into. sorry that I read that wrong. :P

Canada's best barrel makers.

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So, Its been a while, and the firearm has been in storage since my last post. I bought a house, with a nice garage and will be planning on a workshop soon enough (with a loft for my ham radio shack). So more work is to be done, on ALL of my firearms then.

As for now, I will be bringing this Krag into work with me to get some hands on time. Im an Armourer for Canadas Glorious Army, and I have a WAY better workshop and tooling there at my disposal. I was not keen on mixing work and pleasure.. but I dont see any other choise for this poor rifle at this time. If I want to hunt with it.. I had better get on this NOW!

  High Cap'n

I would suggest that before you go the fire lap route try paper patching.  plain old news print is pretty aggressive. try a half dozen PP first.  It's aggressive on corrosion ad crud but much less so on steel.  more of a polish.

Hope this helps Cap'n

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