I did some chrono work this week during break-in with my newly rebarreled 1898. Interesting results:

                                         
Type            Wt.      Type            Low      High       Avg        SD      ES      #shots
Horn      220      41.2      H4831      1951      2001       1970  18      50        6
Horn      220      40      IMR4350      1939      2209       2077  83      270        7
Rem      220      New      Keenbore      2016      2381       2227 178      365        4

Speaking of chronographs - does anyone know anything about old ones? I have a great piece of machinery, mostly brass, weighing probably 50# with some of the finest machining I've ever seen - do not think it is complete, but is fascinating. It's not accessible for photos just now. Marked Modern-Bond as I recall - electromechanical (VERY mechanical) in operation. I'm guessing 1930s, but could be earlier.

Kerz wrote on May 17^th, 2017 at 10:28am:

I did some chrono work this week during break-in with my newly rebarreled 1898. Interesting results:                                           Type            Wt.      Type            Low      High       Avg        SD      ES      #shots Horn      220      41.2      H4831      1951      2001       1970  18      50        6 Horn      220      40      IMR4350      1939      2209       2077  83      270        7 Rem      220      New      Keenbore      2016      2381       2227 178      365        4

What did your targets look like for the three?  Which gave the better group

Re the Modern-Bond chronograph.  The 1941 edition of Phil Sharpe's Complete Guide to Handloading has a couple of photos of the chronographs of the day.  Section is not in the more common 1937 edition.

Thanks much. I have his classic work on rifles, but not the handloading one. Nice to know about the difference in editions, too.

Culpeper wrote on May 17^th, 2017 at 2:39pm:

Kerz wrote on May 17th, 2017 at 10:28am: I did some chrono work this week during break-in with my newly rebarreled 1898. Interesting results:                                           Type            Wt.      Type            Low      High       Avg        SD      ES      #shots Horn      220      41.2      H4831      1951      2001       1970  18      50        6 Horn      220      40      IMR4350      1939      2209       2077  83      270        7 Rem      220      New      Keenbore      2016      2381       2227 178      365        4 What did your targets look like for the three?  Which gave the better group

It looks like the H4831 load (1.8 MOA) but I really need to do some more work.  100 and 200 yd data would be good.  Will wait until I get an 1902 rear sight.  It shoots way left about 4 MOA

Left as compared to the line of bore sighting, or left compared to some other load?  Just curious as Poyer often wrote about people complaining the rifles shot to the left.  I can't see that happening with a right hand twist.  Oh, I can see sights not aligned properly, back before they had windage adjustment, but if there's any curve to the trajectory from the bullet's revolution, it ought to be to the right.  Course, things are not always the way my head figures they ought to be.  Hey, that old Kleenbore 220 was humping, bet the powder dried out over the years.

Yeah, they all shot left (testing at 70 yds).  That would be left of bore sighting per se.
The Kleenbore was really inconsistent as well RE velocity.  Not sure about powder dried out but the bullets had bimetallic bonded to the case.  I tried to pull some with Hornady collet puller.  Damn difficult.  Some wouldn't even pull.  Just tried a few.  A shame though, I was given 4 boxes.
Vic

'Kerz' - Try using Seating Die to push bullet into case, slightly, to break 'corrosive bond' between bullet and case mouth.

Then pull bullet with collet or inertia puller.

Polish bullets in vibrating Case Cleaner.

Clean case mouths with brush & case lube and wipe dry.

I would toss the powder. I suspect bullets bonded to case mouth or deteriorating powder may cause higher pressures and velocity in this old commercial ammo.

Yelp, very good point.  I have done similar to break the seal on military ammo.  Though it really had slipped my mind until you mentioned it.  So went to the gun room and gave it a try on a few rounds.  Damn, talkin' 'bout a bonding!  The shoulder collapsed and bullets never moved.

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Wow! I would have stopped after ruining One case, that way.

Your Case Mouths look heavily crimped into Bullet Cannelure. I suspect that may be the actual problem.

An inertia 'puller' would be worth a try. (I'd start with the five ruined ones)!

Dick Hosmer wrote on May 17^th, 2017 at 4:43pm:

Thanks much. I have his classic work on rifles, but not the handloading one. Nice to know about the difference in editions, too.

Phil Sharpe's Complete Guide to Handloading is his magnum opus, far better writing & subject matter than "The Rifle in America" which has a lot of cut & paste from catalogs of the day.  The 1941 edition is pretty rare.  I have only seen one and I grabbed it.  But there is plenty in the 1937 edition to interest anyone curious about Depression-era handloading. 

You could use the bearing from a Model A Ford generator to resize your .45 ACP brass.  Drive the cases through with a 3/8" bolt and your hammer.  Decap with a nail & your hammer.  Re-prime with a wood dowel and your shop vise.

IIRC, almost 2 pages of handloads for the Krag.

The regular bound editions are very well made and not that hard to find.  But the book is in the public domain and is on the web as a free download.  All you have to do is search.

Nice to know.  I have a 41 Edition, signed June 19,1942.  To Hugh J McKelroy, Warren PA.  Keep shooting, Phil Sharpe.  Fellow off Culver's with the handle of Ramon sent it to me after I sent him a model 92 sight.

butlersrangers wrote on May 19^th, 2017 at 11:59am:

Wow! I would have stopped after ruining One case, that way. Your Case Mouths look heavily crimped into Bullet Cannelure. I suspect that may be the actual problem. An inertia 'puller' would be worth a try. (I'd start with the five ruined ones)!

We are kinda doubling up on this this threat but:
I was just trying to bump the bullet back just enough to allow for removal. 
What I did find on the two that removed was excessive corrosion,  No surprise, I'm sure.
No sure a kinetic puller would do the job.
Vic

'Vic' - The 'inertia' puller worked for me, years ago, with some old French 8mm Lebel 1935 'N' machine gun rounds. Those bullets were heavily crimped and really tough to budge!

It is worth a try to salvage those components.

If you use the inertia puller, strike it on an anvil or brick... or just on the concrete floor.  Doing it on a wood workbench and the wood is soft enough to soften the impact, which does make a difference.

I crimped some Hornady 150gr FMJs like that once.  I used a collet die somehow to make the crimp.  I had to pull them down as the crimp made for too much pressure.  The edge of the crimp groove was square on the bottom, but a bit rounded at the top.  That allowed me to seat the bullet a bit more, but just a bit, trying to seat it a bunch collapsed the shoulder like the OP's.  Had the upper edge of that groove been square, I think I'd have had no choice but to shoot them.  After moving the bullet a tad the kinectic puller worked.  I think if both edges of the groove are square, they'll take a lot of whacks with a kinetic puller.

The extreme spread values on your last two loads are quite high - indicative of erratic pressure behavior. We're these recentl reloads or perhaps old ammo? I once had some old 270 handloads given to me by my wife's grandfather. They gave wildly erratic velocities and signs of high pressure in my Model 70. After shooting a few I broke a couple down and found the powder was deteriorating (bad smell, odd colors). I pulled all the bullets and tossed everything else. The pressures I was seeing scared me. What spurred me to share that story was I saw very large ES values shot to shot.

Old ammo, judging by that hollowpoint bullet.  My grandma kept a live SL-43 50BMG round that my uncle brought from gunnery school in her nick knack cabinet for nigh 60yrs.  Uncle was a B-24 ball turret gunner.  I pulled it down and found that the brass had pulled all the moisture out of the powder, the inside of the case was green, the powder was starting to turn to dust.  I used some of the powder in 6.5 Japanese loads, it wasn't burning at no 4831 speed!

Tested a load today using 41.3 grs H4831, 220 gr Hornady soft point, 303 Winchester brass at 100 yds.  Very good results.  Using my rebarreled (Criterion) and newly installed 1902 rear sight.  I did re-adjust the POI and further rezeroed it for 200 yds.  I had planned to do a little rapid practice but ran into a feeding problem.  I'll start another thread for that problem.
Vic

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Update:
Well after my absolute train wreck at Perry, I've made a few changes.  Installed a proper front sight blade, clean some trigger parts (made a significant improvement from the previous 7+ lbs) and zeroed the 1902 sight with "V" notch as opposed to the aperture. 
Also tried reloading the Hornady 160 Gr FXT bullet with 41.5 grs IMR4350.  The chrono results averaged 2228 FPS (5 shots) vs 1920 FPS 41.3 grs H4831/220 Hornady.
The 160 FXT was originally designed for 30-30 tube fed rifles, providing improved range and accuracy, i.e 300 yard capability.
Groups noted below.
Vic

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220 Hornady group

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Speaking of Perry...  Tried to find you Kerz.  I was hoping to meet you and shoot together in our group.  Hopefully, we can meet up sometime soon...

Paul,
I must apologize, several people were at my campsite (on Post) the evening of the dinner (although it was always doubtful I would be able to make it) including a good friend from Australia.  I did walk down the line that morning in hopes I would run into you.  I was at a centerline target.
Vic

Well, then you were pretty close to us, as we were just to the left of the range officer's tower.  We shot 1 & 2 and pitted 3 & 4.  Really sorry we missed... but I understand about having your friends there.  Next year, we'll try to do it again!  I'd like to continue the dinner too as a new tradition to go along with the annual Roosevelt Match!

Paul

BTW the charger worked great!