An interesting thread is developing on the Gunboards Forum. On the "Military Mauser Forum", a Poster started a thread - "1891 argentine in 30-40 Krag!".

The Poster had seen an early Mauser in a gun shop that he took to be an 1891 Argentine Mauser. It was marked 30-40 on the barrel. The rifle had few if any markings, no crest, and no graduations on the rear sight.

He asked about it on the Mauser forum. He went back to the gun shop to take some pictures and get more information.

The shop owner asked him what he was doing? The poster asked if the rifle was for sale and got it for $300.

The two pictures, he posted so far, are intriguing!

It appears he may have obtained a rifle that was submitted for the 1892 U.S. Trials (Mauser entry #4 in an experimental .30 cal. rimmed cartridge). (The 30-40 marking may have been added later).

Hopefully, more pictures will be posted. Definitely worth looking at!

p.s. It appears like trial rifle No. 27, (Mauser entry #4), illustrated in Brophy, The Krag Rifle, page 245.

Photos of possible 1892 Trials prototype Mauser from Gunboard's Forum:

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Those sorts of things come up now & again.  If a guy was not a dyed-in-the-wool enthusiast for historical arms, he or she would never know what it was.  Good on him!

What happened to the rifles rejected from those or any other trials?

This U.S. Patent Drawing appears to be similar to the Trials Rifle #27, Mauser No. 4, supplied chambered for the F.A. experimental .30 cal. rimmed cartridge.

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The proud owner posted some nice pictures today. The discussion is quite fascinating!

(p.s. - The caliber marking appears it was added later, possibly by a gunsmith).

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Whatever the designation of the original cartridge (developed with the last of the Trapdoor actions?) it was not ".30-40 Krag".

The owner has a very rare rifle, but how great is the interest?  What is the value?  If you found one at a gunshow, how much would you offer? 

IIRC - Frankford Arsenal developed a rimmed, smokeless, .30 caliber cartridge that was used in some of the arms entered in the 1892 and 1893 trials. This evolved into the .30 U.S. Army cartridge.

The possible trial Mauser rifle may be chambered for the .30 F.A. rimmed cartridge. The '.30-40 KRAG' marking is likely a much later hand-stamped addition.

I believe some late trap-door rifles were used to test .30 caliber rimless experimental cartridges that became the .30-03 cartridge.

I saw a 30-40 Trapdoor once, I think it was in a TX museum.  Interesting rear sight the mauser has, with that double notch when down, looks like there might be some limited windage adjustment.  The 30-40 on the mauser barrel appears to me to have been stamped on later, maybe by the fellow who liberated it from the Armory?  I've seen a few rifles over the years that might have walked out of Springfield's collection.

The rear "v" notch can be folded down. This feature was on model 1871 and model 71/84 Mausers. When 'up' it is likely a 'battle sight'.

butlersrangers wrote on Feb 12^th, 2018 at 2:16am:

IIRC - Frankford Arsenal developed a rimmed, smokeless, .30 caliber cartridge that was used in some of the arms entered in the 1892 and 1893 trials. This evolved into the .30 U.S. Army cartridge. The possible trial Mauser rifle may be chambered for the .30 F.A. rimmed cartridge. The '.30-40 KRAG' marking is likely a much later hand-stamped addition. I believe some late trap-door rifles were used to test .30 caliber rimless experimental cartridges that became the .30-03 cartridge.

No, the .30 caliber TDs took a RIMMED round basically indistinguishible from what is now the .30-40 Krag. The rimless .30s were used in other trial arms of the period, such as (IIRC) the Durst. FWIW, our friend Joe Farmer has two (now perhaps 3?) of the Durst rifles, which are of two similar designs. The .30 TDs are well covered in my latest book.

Dick, thanks for correcting my memory error.

Good to hear from you, I was getting concerned about your recent 'absence' from forums.

In "History of Modern U.S. Military Small Arms Ammunition", Vol. 1, 1880-1939, Revised, Hackley, Woodin & Scranton call the cartridge the "Cal .30 Springfield Armory Cartridge".  There were many changes made during the early years.  They also discuss the rimless versions, generically termed "the Cal. .30 rimless Frankford Arsenal cartridge".  The writers assume that one version of the rimless case was the 7.65 x 54 mm Belgian Mauser, loaded with a 215 grain bullet. The book has 5 pages detailing cartridge development 1890-1893.

It has been suggested to the owner of this possible 'trial rifle', that a chamber cast be done. (It is pretty much the consensus of responses on this thread that the '.30-40 KRAG' marking was a later addition).

Some of the bolt 'internals' on this rifle have Belgian/FN ('Z') markings. (I suppose this could be a replacement 'striker-safety assembly' from a Belgian model 1889 Mauser).

I think this rifle is an amazing curiosity and it has come to be in good hands.

The Mauser Rifle Forum on Gunboards has some interesting posts and contributors. There are several threads that have Springfield Armory 'Mauser trial rifles' content.

butlersrangers wrote on Feb 12^th, 2018 at 7:38am:

Dick, thanks for correcting my memory error. Good to hear from you, I was getting concerned about your recent 'absence' from forums.

I appreciate your concern! Am fine, just busy, and there has simply not been a great number of subjects of interest (to me) on any of the various boards recently. Also, you do a great job here, as I've said in the past. My guns are locked away, and I'm not a cellphone camera user, so, I really appreciate your instant responses.

I'm glad you are "OK". I will get busy and be quiet so we hear more from You!

CELLPHONES are Cameras??? Tell me more!

butlersrangers wrote on Feb 12^th, 2018 at 5:15pm:

I'm glad you are "OK". I will get busy and be quiet so we hear more from You! CELLPHONES are Cameras??? Tell me more!

You always respond so quickly with relevant pics that I just assumed you used your trusty cell-phone.

I use a Canon!

('PowerShot A3100', handy little pocket camera with convenient memory cards).

In my mind cameras are for pictures and cell phones 'flip open' & stay in the car for emergencies. I try to avoid emergencies!

butlersrangers wrote on Feb 12^th, 2018 at 5:42am:

The rear "v" notch can be folded down. This feature was on model 1871 and model 71/84 Mausers. When 'up' it is likely a 'battle sight'.

Thanks for clarifying that for me BR, my brain was having a hard time with it!  Let's see, that part won't move laterally, the other part is limited in movement....