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 25 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question (Read 26077 times)
Marksc
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1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Oct 11th, 2017 at 2:34pm
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Just acquired 1898 Krag. with all the research I was able to find online, it appears to be a 1898 carbine. correct 22" barrel, correct unmodified stock but one thing odd. It does not have a serial # stamped on receiver next to Model 1898 US Springfield Armory. Any Ideas?

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« Last Edit: Oct 11th, 2017 at 5:08pm by Marksc »  
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FredC
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Re: Krag Serial # Question
Reply #1 - Oct 11th, 2017 at 2:53pm
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We all like to see pictures of nice looking Krag carbines. The regulars are here are good at solving mysteries, so please get us some photos.

I had to send an email in the middle of typing the short reply and your photo was there when I finished.
I remember someone else had one with no serial number, forgot the details of why.
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #2 - Oct 11th, 2017 at 5:16pm
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'Marksc' - Welcome to the KCA Forum.

I think the logical answer is that someone (God knows why?) removed the serial number from your Krag's receiver. It should be where there is a vague 'cross like' shadow area on your receiver.

Your nice carbine stock is the later type (1899) 'long forearm' stock. These often were used as replacements, during refurbishment or repair of model 1898 carbines, to make them identical to the model 1899 carbine.

Is there a cartouche mark or 'proof P' stamp on your stock?

Is your model 1896 rear-sight a rifle or carbine sight?

Your side-plate screw appears overly long and your magazine cut-off lever is missing. This suggests to me that someone had a Redfield 'no-drill' peep-sight (102-K or 70-K) on this carbine for 'Hunting', at some time.

  
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98src
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Re: 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #3 - Oct 11th, 2017 at 5:20pm
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Is that a M1892 sight?
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #4 - Oct 11th, 2017 at 5:49pm
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It looks like a model 1896 rifle sight without its 'slide'.
  
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Marksc
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Re: 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #5 - Oct 11th, 2017 at 6:39pm
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The receiver has no distortion from round finish or flat area from any numbers being ground off. A perfect finish. The sight is a 1986 with a C stamped on the side. The cutout I removed because it felt like it was sticking. Appears to be a little bent. Would like to replace. There is no cartouche or P on stock. Just behind the trigger guard is a stamped 50.
  
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FredC
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Re: 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #6 - Oct 11th, 2017 at 6:41pm
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"I think the logical answer is that someone (God knows why?) removed the serial number from your Krag's receiver. It should be where there is a vague 'cross like' shadow area on your receiver." Quoting BR
If someone ground and buffed the number out, there would be a major depression. A strait edge/ruler would show up such a depressed area. Lay the ruler length wise above and below the stamped area and it should show up easily.
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #7 - Oct 11th, 2017 at 7:14pm
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Model 1896 carbine rear-sights are quite valuable. (The carbine 'slide' is different than the rifle slide).

Carbine sights have been faked.

There is a good feature (on sights and model '96 fakes) on the KCA Website main page, accessed by using the 'photos' tab.

The shaft of your magazine cut-off lever can be easily straightened. Use a copper, brass or plastic mallet and pound it 'true' on a hardwood surface.
  
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Marksc
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Re: 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #8 - Oct 11th, 2017 at 7:28pm
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Just placed a engineers straight edge on receiver from 8 oclock to 12 oclock position. Dead straight. Never any numbers stamped on this one.
  
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Marksc
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Re: 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #9 - Oct 11th, 2017 at 7:41pm
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That's it, just missing slide. Thank You for all the input. New to this site.
  
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1911Ron
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Re: 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #10 - Oct 12th, 2017 at 4:58pm
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Welcome Mark!
  
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Local Boy
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Re: 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #11 - Oct 12th, 2017 at 6:22pm
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In "The Krag Rifle Story", 2nd Edition, Chapter 19: Collectors Notes there's a paragraph that states:

"Prototype Model 1898 rifles were marked "Model 1897", and receivers of rifles chambered for experimental cannelured cartridges were marked "Model 1899".  These rifles have no serial numbers".

Maybe just adding to the mystery since we're talking rifles and your carbine is not marked Model 1897 or 1899.
  
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Marksc
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Re: 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #12 - Oct 12th, 2017 at 6:48pm
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Wow, There's a mind bender. Does a P stamped on barrel 1/2" up from receiver help with anything. There is a P also on the front ring of receiver where barrel connects to receiver.
Great Info.
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #13 - Oct 12th, 2017 at 8:55pm
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The "P" on the barrel and the "P" on the front of the receiver ring are the standard Springfield Armory marks, indicating the parts had been tested with Proof Loads.

Receivers and barrels were proof tested before being assembled into arms. Barrels were proofed before being rifled.

Receivers received stamped markings and serial numbers after heat treat.

Numbered/completed receivers went into 'parts' bins', and were pulled out (kind of) randomly for assembly, hence the difficulty in exactly dating Krags by serial number.

Completed Krags underwent a final proof procedure and received the 'circle P' stamp on the stock. (Description attached).

The U.S. government paid a royalty on each Krag-Jorgensen that Springfield Armory manufactured.

I do not know why your receiver appears 'unnumbered'.

FWIW - Possibly, the number was skillfully removed (or filled in with weld) and re-contoured by someone?

Maybe, a Springfield Armory worker stole a receiver, prior to numbering, and took it home in his lunch-pail to build his own Krag?

It was a 'Special-Ops Krag', used in an undocumented secret mission? (Joking).

Several S.A. workmen and inspectors screwed up on a Monday morning and stiffed the Norwegians?

(I am skeptical of the prototype thing).

It boggles the imagination and probably makes you a Felon! (Just kidding).
« Last Edit: Oct 13th, 2017 at 2:18pm by butlersrangers »  
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Marksc
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Re: 1898 Krag Missing Serial # Question
Reply #14 - Oct 12th, 2017 at 10:39pm
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I am going to take some better pics and post. It definitely has not been altered or welded and resurfaced. I am 100 percent sure now that it has been broke down and examined it is a carbine that has never had a serial number stamped on it. I am still open to suggestions and appreciate all the knowledge everyone is giving. Thank you everybody.
  
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