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 25 New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock (Read 2468 times)
butlersrangers
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #15 - Jan 27th, 2019 at 9:38pm
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Whig's 'new' cleaning-rod appears it could be made from a shortened muzzle-loading Springfield rod, with a new head welded on. The white arrow points to a possible seam.

(Of course, all my comments regarding Whig's neat 'new' Krag are pure conjecture on my part. Others may have better or different opinions and insights on this neat rifle).
  
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Dick Hosmer
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #16 - Jan 27th, 2019 at 9:58pm
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No, it is not. That stock shows a great deal of thought, and lot of high-quality work, but to espouse the theory that it began life at SA is wishful thinking. The tip cut is not right, and sloppy to boot. The rod is absolutely not right, and I have some doubts (at least from the pictures/angles shown so far) as to the virginity of the upper band. Ditto the sideplate, and, am I the only one who thinks the edges of the barrel crown are not QUITE sharp enough? I'd measure the barrel length REAL carefully - only a few thousandths need to come off to 'almost' flatten a standard crown.

Not "trashing" either, honestly, but "not right" is "not right". I only hope Whig did not pay top collector dollar.
  
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #17 - Jan 27th, 2019 at 10:05pm
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I believe a cursory examination of the forestock flutes ("finger grooves") shows them to be a modern product, cut not with the original ~3" cutter wheel but with a smaller ball-end router bit. Note how the origin of the flute differs on these two -

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(Note also wood proud of handguard and band - surprising defects in an otherwise outstanding job of stock reproduction.)

Study attached detail from a description of the tooling used to cut similar flutes on the US M1903 to see how the cutter was used to produce more gradual entry and exit -
  
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Whig
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #18 - Jan 27th, 2019 at 11:48pm
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A couple things regarding above. I think the ramrod is a new production with the head apparently welded on. The metal is very smooth with a new bluing finish. It does not appear to be a remake of an old ramrod of any type.

The barrel is exactly 30 inches, measured correctly, exactly the same as my other 1894. The muzzle is not flattened- is was made this way a long time ago. The patina is consistent with many of my other Krags and fairly even with the rest of the metal parts on this rifle.

The side plate, as you can see, is authentic and marked with the rifle's serial number as is my other 1894 side plate. The magazine cover is also with the same serial number matching the receiver. The bolt is the same on both rifles.

So, most of the metal is authentic and correct. I am not sure about the ramrod channel in the front barrel band. The top of that barrel band that fits the top of the barrel is also very clean and sharp but the barrel band itself sure looks original to a Krag if it isn't an original 1894 ramrod band.

The stock is new. I would just like to know who made it. As I said, it is not perfect but it is very nicely done. I didn't notice the difference in the finger groove cuts on the hand guard. Thanks for pointing that out. Those are the details I appreciate learning about. I like the critiques. That's what we're here for. I'm happy with this addition to my collection and, as all of them beforehand, I am learning a ton about Krags by tearing this one down to the minute details!
  
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Dick Hosmer
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #19 - Jan 28th, 2019 at 4:40am
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Well, you've got me on the sideplate. As you know, 1892 sideplates have a SLIGHTLY different look on the outside, a feature which is not clear to me in your photo, but the numbering would seem to settle it. Good discussion!
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #20 - Jan 28th, 2019 at 7:43am
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FWIW - It appears the shaping of the replica Stock, in the area around the side-plate, is a little off.

Whig: You will want to make sure the rear of plate, #1631, is not in contact with the Stock, before shooting.

Otherwise, the small section of wood, between the side-plate and cut-off, is likely to 'shear off', like it did on your original early Stock.

(Note arrow on lower picture indicating apparent contact).
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #21 - Jan 28th, 2019 at 8:09am
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I believe an early front barrel-band has the inside contour, that I roughly 'colored' in red.
« Last Edit: Jan 28th, 2019 at 10:19pm by butlersrangers »  
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Whig
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #22 - Jan 28th, 2019 at 11:38am
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Thanks for the warning about the wood but I don't plan on shooting this one at this time. I have my "shooters" and the rest I am cleaning up and fixing up and learning from for a collection. The barrel band has kept me wondering about those shapely cornered areas where the ramrod channel is fixated. All of the ones I've seen in real life and pictures are rounded like you point out. It is definitely not 100% original but a nice rifle with many correct parts. I hoped someone would eventually know the origin of the stock but I'll keep digging. Thanks for all the analysis though.

If the barrel band is a "creation", though, it, again, is nicely done.
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #23 - Jan 28th, 2019 at 6:33pm
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Everything is nicely done on your 'new' Krag and it begs to be shot and used!
  
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Whig
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #24 - Jan 28th, 2019 at 7:49pm
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You may be right!
  
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Local Boy
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #25 - Jan 28th, 2019 at 10:25pm
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Hi Whig,

If you feel comfortable doing the woodwork... I would consider taking the high spots, on the butt stock, down to match the butt plate.

I would also consider removing some of the wood at the back of the front band to even things out.

Just a suggestion... otherwise I'd call it good and not dink with it.

BTW: Very nice Old Timer Krag you got there!
  
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Whig
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #26 - Jan 28th, 2019 at 10:49pm
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I have thought about those two areas that are a little proud of the metal but I know it's not perfect and I have slathered it with linseed oil and it all looks nice and darker now than it did. I think I'm going to leave this gem as is and keep it for further investigation in the future as a nice addition to my collection.

It may, yet, be at the range soon for testing!
  
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Re: New 1894 Acquisition with Reproduction Stock
Reply #27 - Jan 29th, 2019 at 6:17pm
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butlersrangers wrote on Jan 28th, 2019 at 8:09am:
I believe an early front barrel-band has the inside contour, that I roughly 'colored' in red.


If the only difference is the radii in the corners near the thread that could be a tooling change during production. The sharp edge on those old tool steels would have been hard to maintain. Adding the radii to the broach would have made the tool last longer and during the tools life it easier sharpen. Each sharpening during the tools life would have made the radii larger. Maybe this piece was made with the first tool before a change was made.

If I was doing the fitting this to a reproduction stock it would be so much easier to take the corners off the stock compared with the time and expense to square up the corners in the barrel band. You might look inside the band and see if the tool marks indicate original work or a later modification.
  
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