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 10 Original US Army 30-40 Load (Read 5954 times)
7th1st
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Original US Army 30-40 Load
May 23rd, 2019 at 2:23am
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I recently picked up my first Krag (1898) and am anxious to shoot it.  Is there a place to buy 30-40 Krag ammo that is close to the original Army load?  My gunsmith told me to avoid the modern commercial ammunition because while the action can handle those loads, it will put too much stress on the stock and risks cracking it.  I did some research and if I recall the Core-Lokt had a velocity of 2200+ fps I think. I also read in either Mallory or Brophy's book that the Army switched to a 2200 fps round around 1901.  The new round cracked locking lugs on the bolts and the Army returned to the original load.  I plan on reloading, but want to start with some store bought rounds first.  Thanks for the help.
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: Original US Army 30-40 Load
Reply #1 - May 23rd, 2019 at 2:43am
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Most of us have fired a considerable amount of factory loads in our Krags with no ill results. U.S. commercial loads have long been designed for the pressure limitations of the Krag.

IMHO - 'bedding problems' cause most stock cracks - too much tension on rear trigger-guard screw, bad fit of rear of action in stock, or no barrel-band (which allows barrel to lift and torque stock).

I disagree with your gunsmith.

Most Re-Loading Manuals give good data for the U.S. Krag.
  
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Whig
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Re: Original US Army 30-40 Load
Reply #2 - May 23rd, 2019 at 8:57am
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I second butlers comments. Each Krag rifle or carbine should be examined by someone competent to make sure it is assembled properly and has no specific defects that might interfere with normal use, as with any firearm. But most of us have shot just about anything and everything available from the factory in our Krags and have very rarely heard of any problems. Most of us also save all of the brass we can find, new and older, and reload with many different bullet weights and powders. Of course it is vitally important to use care in reloading and use accepted loads recommended by dependable sources. There are pressure concerns with fast burning powders and higher powder loads. You have to be careful with crimping the cases to prevent higher pressures too.

But, you should be safe with newer factory 30-40 Krag ammunition. Old military ammo could pose some problems with older powder, bad primers that give squib fires or hang fires and weak cases that split easy. Older ammo is great for collecting but not shooting.

If you get some ammo and shoot your Krag, please report back to us and let us know how it worked. We love to hear success stories and help with any problems.
  
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psteinmayer
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Re: Original US Army 30-40 Load
Reply #3 - May 23rd, 2019 at 2:34pm
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FWIW, Remington, Winchester and Hornady factory ammo is generally loaded with a 180 gr "Sptizer" bullet firing north of 2200 fps, and is completely safe for all Krags.  The problem with the cracked lugs occurred when they tried to push a 220 gr RN bullet to 2200 fps, which was in excess of established safe pressures.  If you want to reload, you might consider starting with some factory ammo and saving the brass (it's how most of us acquired our stash).  Also, Hornady and Graf & Sons both have new brass available too! 

Now... if you want to recreate the original ammo, then a 220 gr RN bullet and 40.0 grains of IMR-4350 is as close as you'll ever get!  Hornady makes a 220 RN which, although not a FMJ bullet, comes nearly identical to the original bullet dimensions.
They perform excellent in matches.  I load mine with CCI #34 Mil-Spec primers, although a CCI-200 works well too.  Really, any good primer should have good results. 
« Last Edit: May 23rd, 2019 at 3:53pm by psteinmayer »  
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Re: Original US Army 30-40 Load
Reply #4 - May 23rd, 2019 at 3:53pm
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I agree.  I think your gunsmith has taken one too many hits off the paint can.  Unless he can find any cracks in your bolt or recevier then your Krag is GTG.

Store bought ammo is the only way I get my brass.  Of course I have great bias for Remington and Winchester brass.

(You need to Login to view media files and links) Ammoseek is your friend.

Buy a case.  Shoot from two boxes until that brass is reloaded to death. Buy another case.  Shoot two more boxes from the first case until brass is worn out.  Buy another case.  Repeat the process until the first is case is exhausted.

I use the same receipe except I run Sierra 220grains RN and Winchester primers.

Let us know how it shoots and as always...  Pictures!




  

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7th1st
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Re: Original US Army 30-40 Load
Reply #5 - May 27th, 2019 at 5:07am
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Thanks for all the information!  I took it out and shot it this weekend with Remington Core-Lokt.  It grouped pretty nicely from 100.  I am very glad I picked up the Krag. 

Regarding the cracked lugs...what fps will 40 grains of powder and a 220 grain bullet do?  I am assuming that load is different than the load the Army used for the short period where they had the problems.  I am going to look into the two bullets (Hornady and Sierra) and buy some dies.  That rifle was a lot of fun to shoot, but until I start reloading it will be expensive...
  
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Whig
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Re: Original US Army 30-40 Load
Reply #6 - May 27th, 2019 at 9:08am
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When I chronographed some of my loads in one of my military configuration 30" Krag rifles last year, I was getting around 2150-2200 fps with the standard 220 gr. Hornady RN bullet with 40.0 gr IMR-4350 powder and a standard large rifle primer. This was in October so I don't think it was too hot or too cold.
  
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psteinmayer
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Re: Original US Army 30-40 Load
Reply #7 - May 27th, 2019 at 9:58pm
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With the 220 and 40.0 grains of the IMR-4350, you should be right around 2000 fps, per the original ammo.  The Hornady and Sierra bullets, although both RN have different shape/ogive.  The Hornady perform better in my Krag, while the Sierra is more accurate for others.  Try both and see which one is better for you!

As for the cracked lugs, stick with the established loads found in your standard loading manuals... and avoid the suggestions of the so called "Experts" who have that "Perfect" pet load.  If you keep the pressures below 40,000 CUP, then you should never have a problem.
  
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7th1st
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Re: Original US Army 30-40 Load
Reply #8 - May 29th, 2019 at 2:54am
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Thanks for all the info.  I ordered some RCBS dies and the Sierra 220 grain from Brownells today.  I am looking forward to taking my Krag out to shoot more often.
  
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Whig
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Re: Original US Army 30-40 Load
Reply #9 - May 29th, 2019 at 11:14am
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Not all Krags shoot these loads the same. Try this basic one out and fine tune if you need to. There are many factors that can affect accuracy other than bullet weight and powder. The choice of primer could be a small factor (regular large rifle compared to magnum), make sure that the primer holes are clean and open. Reforming the brass after you shoot it in your Krag should be neck only resizing if you are using the same firearm. Seating depth (and OAL of the loaded round) can affect accuracy based on the exact dimensions and character of your chamber and how tight your bullet is fixed in the neck of the case. Most people don't crimp the round after seating the bullet unless you are trying to use pointed Spitzer type bullets that may not feed through the magazine well. Then, very slight crimping may be helpful to prevent the bullet from being pushed back into the case with being fed through the magazine. But, crimping can increase the pressure generated in the chamber which can affect accuracy. Too much pressure can be dangerous, also, so be careful. If you are having neck splitting on your brass, they may need to be annealed which needs to be done properly. Improper annealing can soften the head of the case and cause tremendous damage to the rifle and possibly to you.

So, go slow with changes and let us know if you are having any problems. We'll do what we can to help out and maybe learn ourselves along the way!
  
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Re: Original US Army 30-40 Load
Reply #10 - Jun 14th, 2019 at 5:14pm
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I am another new Krag owner. Let me ask, is there anything wrong headed about using 37.5gr 4350 with Hornady 220 RN bullets for 1800 fps? No trial and error. Hornady 9th manual shows that as a middle load with 40gr as the max and 34.5gr as a safe min.  I am looking at 100 yard shooting.

If that makes sense, I could get the same ballistics with another middle level load of 40gr 4831 for the same 1800 fps and better load density.  Does it matter?
  
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Whig
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Re: Original US Army 30-40 Load
Reply #11 - Jun 14th, 2019 at 5:19pm
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I think you'd be real safe working with that as a starting load. Your Krag will shoot differently than ours will, they each have their own personality. But, start there and see where you go.

Keep us informed.
  
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