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 25 New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags (Read 14278 times)
cquickel
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New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Jul 24th, 2019 at 7:52pm
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Has anyone established an US Military Krag Rifle database for early 1892 / 1894 Krags other than SRC?  It would be interesting to see which rifles still exist and the serial numbered parts on these rifles
  

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Culpeper
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #1 - Jul 24th, 2019 at 8:53pm
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I was in the process of running a census based on Mallory appendix.  However I left the book at home when I came to Africa.

I was copying the pages to pdf and converting them to OCR and then porting them to he excel.  The hard part was hitting the auctions and places like gunbroker to record serial numbers.  But I am just one man.  Hold on a sec.  Yep, a man.

It was my idea to build on Mr. Mallory's (Praise to his name) work by adding a new column to record the date of any observed serial number in current existance.

  

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Whig
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #2 - Jul 25th, 2019 at 12:33am
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As I spent many months reading through the wonderful historic posts here on KCA when I first joined as a member, I eventually came to the realization that there have been a wealth of reported serial numbers of all types of Krag rifles, carbines, sporterized and original military configurations that could be listed and referenced. It just would take a ton of time and patience reading through these posts and listing everything.

Maybe something for someone with more time and patience, and computer skills, than I have!
  
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Culpeper
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #3 - Jul 25th, 2019 at 4:19am
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Would it not be better to unify in a main project where a couple hundred eyes are reporting to a database the continuing existance of Krag rifles"

Some fourms have a special closed sub-forum that open only to members with a second log on.  Serial numbers could be placed in that out of sight location from the general world in there is a privacy concern.

more to follow.
  

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Whig
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #4 - Jul 25th, 2019 at 10:20am
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What is the purpose or need to keep it private? I have never been a fan of hiding serial numbers when discussing firearms on the internet. Unless someone gives me a good reason to do so, I'll stick with keeping this kind of "database" open to all. It would definitely engender more input and support form non members who would be willing to add their info.

Just my current opinion.

Excellent idea, though.
  
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Ned Butts
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #5 - Jul 25th, 2019 at 11:35am
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We could start a serial number thread here. Lets kick it around a bit and work out some details and guide lines.
  
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Whig
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #6 - Jul 25th, 2019 at 11:43am
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Thanks, Ned. I don't think we need anything fancy. Just serial number, rifle or carbine length, sporterized or original military configuration.

I know many want to know about the front sight, the rear sight, the presence of cartouche, bore condition, etc. We can get so demanding with info that it might be a turn off. Don't know. I'd like to see what others think also. Maybe an asterisk next to a serial number if it is documented in SRS.

I would like KCA to have an official listing of serial numbers and dates of manufacture best agreed upon for those serial numbers. As I have stated before, I don't know which reference is best and what most people use. Butlers has educated me before about this topic!
  
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Culpeper
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #7 - Jul 25th, 2019 at 1:29pm
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Any way.  It was my thought to keep it simple.  The serial number; Model - 1894, 1895, 1896, Model 1896, Model 1898, Model 1899; the date last seen in existance; and maybe four choices of its condition such as RO-receiver only, BR -barreled receiver, Cutdown, or Military.  Perhaps Military Carbine or Military Rifle when last seen.

It would be great if some of the founders of KCA who have large collections would add their guns to the list.   But if they want to keep who owns what quiet maybe Ned could be the filter.  I don't have a problem adding my numbers to the list as a few of them have already been posted here.

Kinda like this but a lot less noisy.

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Just one guy's opinion.  I am already running my personal Win-Lee census like this.


  

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FredC
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #8 - Jul 25th, 2019 at 2:21pm
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Thinking out loud here maybe a separate section for this with a running thread for each type (original configuration 1 rifles and 2 carbines, 3 sporters and unofficial modified, 4 receivers and barreled receivers.
Do not know if it is possible but one could wish for these threads to automatically put the serial numbers in order. I like Culpeper's table, owner could be KCA member, web, advertisement or other.
Maybe software capable of being combined into a single master list?
  
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Culpeper
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #9 - Jul 25th, 2019 at 3:33pm
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Maybe we could keep the first couple of columns in the same fashion as Mallory.

sn       model    date seen     other   other    other
                      YYYY MM DD

1200  1894R     2015 03 26
4000  1895R     2016 10 00  (where you do not recall the exact date but know the month)
34000  1896R    2016 06 19
55000  M1896C 2017 01 01

and so on.

Some thing like that.






  

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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #10 - Jul 25th, 2019 at 5:26pm
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I'd still suggest less info in a chart. You could have the ending with a line labeled "notes" that could have markings, place seen, damage, etc listed but I think more people would like to just input info like Sn, rifle, carbine, configuration and other info on the "notes" line.

I think rear sight might be good to know with regard to rarer sights and carbines. When I see an 1896 Krag carbine, the first thing I want to check is the rear sight to see if it is an M1896 carbine sight. There are so many out there without the carbine sight. When we examine an M1898 rifle or carbine made in the Aug. 1899 to March 1900 period, we would like to know if it is still wearing an original M98 sight or a M1901 or M1902 sight.
  
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Culpeper
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #11 - Jul 25th, 2019 at 6:34pm
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So it would look like Mallory.  Like this?

sn       model    date seen     notes

Where Mallory used the term Usage in the place of the above suggested Notes.

I'm hip to whatever we come up with but we have to be all in on this.  One or two guys can not search all of the commonly known places on the net that may have Krags.  It would be doomed to semi-failure.  Trust me on that.

I suppose if we really want to get nerdish we could include all of the known destroyed krags from Mallory.   Shocked
« Last Edit: Jul 26th, 2019 at 7:33am by Culpeper »  

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Tom Butts
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #12 - Jul 25th, 2019 at 8:57pm
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I like the thoughts and input here.  Let me cipher on it a bit and ask some more tech savvy than I to see what we might be able to do.
  
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Whig
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #13 - Jul 25th, 2019 at 9:18pm
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I search through hundreds of Krags through auction sites and would be willing to keep track of some of the data from ones I see but I'm not going to write a book on each one! That's why I'm advocating for less detailed info with a section for "notes" or whatever you want to call it for additional information people may want to add about their personally owned Krags.

The more complicated you make it, the less people like me will want to compile and add info for Krags that we see online or in our LGS. If I was retired and had nothing else to do (like shoot my Krags!), I'd be more willing to create huge amounts of data.

Thanks Ned and Tom for working on this. Getting it started is the hardest job!
  
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kragluver
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Re: New Database for US Military 1892 / 1894 Krags
Reply #14 - Jul 26th, 2019 at 12:07am
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I know Joe Farmer compiled such a database some years back on the old Jouster forum. I don't know if he published it or not. I think he was using it to try and discern breakpoints between rifle and carbine production.
  
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