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Krag ammunition (Read 4574 times)
rskyba
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Krag ammunition
Oct 20th, 2014 at 10:53pm
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Hi,

Thought I would relay on some experiences with different ammo. 

I tried Load-X's Krag ammo.  I purchased it directly from LoadX ( (You need to Login to view media files and links) They have a five box minimum so I picked up some .45 ACP as well as 30-40 to get to 5 boxes.  If you order from them via a retailer you'll typically need to get 5 boxes of only Krag ammo.

I liked the fact that it was the original 220 grain specification.  I have Remington's Krag ammo as well but like the older Load-X specification due to the longer barrel of my full length Krag.  Heavier bullets need a slower burning powder (or less of it) due to higher initial chamber pressures.  Longer barrels provide more runway for slower powder and for launching the heavy bullet.  I've always felt the lighter bullet Remington ammo was better suited to sporterized / carbine Krags.

It grouped about as well as the Remington at 200 yards so no complaints with Load-X.  Hard to believe there was a perception this ammo wasn't lethal enough in the old days.  220 grains is all the rage right now with 300 Blackout and some various HP pistol ammo.  Original Krag ammo is twice as fast with near .45 ACP FMJ bullet weight.

I also recently picked up a number of 100 year old spent brass.   I loaded those with American Pioneer Powder black powder substitute to get lower pressures for the brass.  Krag is very similar to .303 British (originally BP) and is from that era so my main concern with BP is corrosion which is solved for with clean American Pioneer Powder.  Most of the residue also stayed in the case which was a nice surprise.  American Pioneer is weaker than other BP substitutes, a positive feature here.  If I wanted a stouter round, I'd go smokeless after all.

It was fun with the smoke!  I mostly plinked with it so no word on grouping but it tagged 50 or so cans / milk jugs. 

Attached is a picture of the round(s).  From the left, Remington, Load-X, and my BP reload.

Anyone else have ammo feedback they want to
  
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psteinmayer
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Re: Krag ammunition
Reply #1 - Oct 21st, 2014 at 12:12am
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Bear in mind that the Krag was not designed for Black Powder.  The .30 USA (as it was originally known) was designed for use with Lafflin and Rand smokeless powder and a 220 grain jacketed round nosed bullet.  40 grains of 4350 and a 220 gr bullet most closely approximates the ballistics of the original round.  I load mine with a CCI 250 magnum primer to ensure that the 4350 burns cleanly, and completely!
  
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madsenshooter
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Re: Krag ammunition
Reply #2 - Oct 22nd, 2014 at 9:45pm
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I had thought of trying some cast bullet loads using the Pioneer powder.  However, I'm looking at a muzzleloader I used the powder in that's sitting in the corner....pretty rusty despite a couple cleanings after shooting.  All I can say is be sure you get it all out, and check often for rust starting to grow again.
  
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Dads Krag
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Re: Krag ammunition
Reply #3 - Oct 22nd, 2014 at 11:27pm
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madsenshooter wrote on Oct 22nd, 2014 at 9:45pm:
I had thought of trying some cast bullet loads using the Pioneer powder.  However, I'm looking at a muzzleloader I used the powder in that's sitting in the corner....pretty rusty despite a couple cleanings after shooting.  All I can say is be sure you get it all out, and check often for rust starting to grow again.

  Most "black power substitutes" are even more corrosive than real black powder.

More expensive, more corrosive, harder to ignite & therefore less consistant & less accurate than the real thing. I never saw the attraction.

I used to shoot 100 rds of SKEET W/a 12ga dbl barrel muzzleloader every Sunday. I bought 2f black powder in 10# quantities for $4.50 a pound.
  
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madsenshooter
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Re: Krag ammunition
Reply #4 - Oct 23rd, 2014 at 3:55am
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The attraction to me was the fact that Pioneer is ascorbic acid based.  Got a good source for vitamin C powder, in case of a SHTF scenario, all I'd need is a nitrate source, and some time to experiment to get the ratio right.  The patent for the stuff is online, but isn't very specific.  Works great in my 50cal muzzleloader under a TC Shockwave 40 caliber, 200gr sabot.  Shot three into a 1.25" group at 100yds.   With 110gr pushing it, velocity, trajectory, and energy would be about the same as a 35 Remington.
  
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Dads Krag
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Re: Krag ammunition
Reply #5 - Oct 23rd, 2014 at 12:59pm
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madsenshooter wrote on Oct 23rd, 2014 at 3:55am:
The attraction to me was the fact that Pioneer is ascorbic acid based.  Got a good source for vitamin C powder, in case of a SHTF scenario, all I'd need is a nitrate source, and some time to experiment to get the ratio right.  The patent for the stuff is online, but isn't very specific.  Works great in my 50cal muzzleloader under a TC Shockwave 40 caliber, 200gr sabot.  Shot three into a 1.25" group at 100yds.   With 110gr pushing it, velocity, trajectory, and energy would be about the same as a 35 Remington.


What makes you think that real black powder would not perform as well?

As far as making your own? If you have the nitrate, find some sulfur, make some charcoal & you could make black powder. The formulas heve been around for several centuries.

The laws of physics & drag coeffecient makes it unlikely that a 200gr .40 caliber bullet would shoot with the same trajectory as a .35 calliber bullet at the same velocity.

I have shot 2" groups from a rest & 4" groups offhand at 100 yds with open iron sights out of my .54 caliber flintlock shooting .535 round balls. It will cleanly take any hoofed big game animal in North America at any range that shooting with iron sights is ethical. I have killed 2 Whittails cleanly ay ranges over 150 yds with a .535 round ball.

45/70s & their ilk normally shoot more accurately in 1000 yd sillouete competition with real black powder compared to smokless powder due to the more consistant Mv.

Black powder substitutes were developed so they could be marketed W/O the storage restrictions placed on black powder. The inconsistancy of ignition lead to the development of inline muzzleloaders & various ignition primers. None of these were needed with black powder.

Before they were bought out by Knight, the Green Mountain Barrel Company advised that the only valid reason to use a black powder substitute was when one could not obtain black powder.
  
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