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Correcting an appraisal done on 1899 Carbine (Read 4509 times)

mcoulter KCA Forum Member Offline Krag Enthusiast! Posts: 4 Joined: Jan 12^th, 2017	Correcting an appraisal done on 1899 Carbine Jan 12^th, 2017 at 9:07pm	Print Post
	After my grandfather passed away my family had an appraisal done on his gun collection which included a 1899 Carbine. (note, this was done almost 17 years ago) I'm trying to learn more about this rifle and make some corrections on aspects of this appraisal I think they got wrong. 1) Serial number. In the appraisal paperwork it listed the SN as 352718. But what I see stamped is different (852718). Am I missing something? Could this just have been a clarical error done during the appraisal? Or are there other numbers on the rifle? Here is a photo: I will add links after I have posted more seeing how this is my first post! 2) Front sight. In the appraisal's description is says: "Good cartouche; bore Good to VG; Original & sound." But as I research this rifle, the front sight is banded which make the "original and sound" part of the appraisal wrong. My understanding is that original carbines do not have a banded sight, correct? Here's another photo: I will add links after I have posted more seeing how this is my first post! The condition was listed as "80%". In the upcoming week's I'll take better photos of the sight and the other markings. More to come!


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mcoulter KCA Forum Member Offline Krag Enthusiast! Posts: 4 Joined: Jan 12^th, 2017	Re: Correcting an appraisal done on 1899 Carbine Reply #1 - Jan 12^th, 2017 at 9:07pm	Print Post
	Photos related to my 1st post above (You need to *Login* to view media files and links) (You need to *Login* to view media files and links)


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Culpeper KCA Forum Member Offline Posts: 904 Location: Right Coast of Africa Joined: Mar 30^th, 2005	Re: Correcting an appraisal done on 1899 Carbine Reply #2 - Jan 12^th, 2017 at 9:59pm	Print Post
	The serial number is a 3. Heavy stampings would cause the 3s to look like 8s. My 1896 sn looks 84xxx when it is 34xxx The stock is a carbine stock. Could you post a picture of the rear sight? left, right, and looking down. It is a 1901 sight, could be either a carbine or rifle sight. Front sight is a M1903 Springfield rifle sight. Close the bolt and run a cleaning rod down to the bore and mark the length at the muzzle. Should be twenty-two inches. I have a 1898 carbine in the same style. It was cut back about an inch and a half. (dang) Any rifle or carbine is only worth what the next guy will pay you for it. Buy Joe Farmer's book if you are going to be collecting and or shooting Krags. It is money very well spent. (You need to *Login* to view media files and links)
	« Last Edit: Jan 13^th, 2017 at 3:54am by Culpeper »
	Deacon in the Church of the Mighty Krag. Member of People Eating Tasty Animals (PETA). (You need to *Login* to view media files and links)
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butlersrangers KCA Forum Member Offline Krag Enthusiast! Posts: 6330 Location: Michigan Bi-Peninsular&Proud Joined: Oct 7^th, 2009	Re: Correcting an appraisal done on 1899 Carbine Reply #3 - Jan 12^th, 2017 at 11:26pm	Print Post
	'mcolter' - Welcome to the KCA Forum. You will have to accept it on faith that your Krag's serial number is 352718. It is not unusual to encounter Krag numbers that are difficult to read. The way some are stamped, it is difficult to differentiate between 3s, 6s, and 8s. On some Krags, it is hard to differentiate between "model 1896" and "model 1898". Less than 500,000 U.S. Krags were manufactured. The highest serial numbers are around 480000. Your Krag receiver is stamped "model 1899". Model 1899 Krags were built as carbines. Most model 1899 carbines will have numbers that fall between 223371 and 368774. (Also, many model 1898 rifles fall between those numbers). Your Krag does not have a Krag carbine front-sight. I envision three possibilities: 1. Barrel is original carbine barrel, with Krag front-sight removed and replaced with 1905 Springfield 'banded' sight. 2. The original carbine barrel was removed, due to pitting, and replaced with a cut-down Krag rifle barrel and 1905 front-sight. (This is common and was privately done). 3. It is a 'so called' NRA/DCM carbine, as altered and sold at Benicia arsenal in the 1920s, and only provable with original Bill of Sale or Receipt. Scenario #2 is the most likely. It is a nice looking Krag and would make a fine shooter. The Collector value is seriously hurt by front-sight alteration. The value is probably in the $600 to $700 range.
	« Last Edit: Jan 13^th, 2017 at 4:22am by butlersrangers »

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psteinmayer KCA Forum Member Offline Krag Enthusiast! Posts: 2391 Location: Ypsilanti, Michgan Joined: Aug 30^th, 2011 Gender:	Re: Correcting an appraisal done on 1899 Carbine Reply #4 - Jan 13^th, 2017 at 12:11pm	Print Post
	Welcome to the forum... and to the wonderful world of Krags. Be careful, they're addicting! Culpepper and Butlersrangers are right on. As Culpepper said, drop a cleaning rod down the barrel against the closed bolt and measure it. I agree that it's most likely a cut down rifle barrel used to replace a damaged/rusted/pitted/shot out barrel. Krag barrels, both carbine and rifle are available from Criterion these days... but this was not always the case, so replacing a carbine barrel with a cut-down rifle barrel would seem like an attractive idea to replace a damaged barrel back in the day. Just my $0.02


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mcoulter KCA Forum Member Offline Krag Enthusiast! Posts: 4 Joined: Jan 12^th, 2017	Re: Correcting an appraisal done on 1899 Carbine Reply #5 - Jan 18^th, 2017 at 7:09pm	Print Post
	Hello again. I now have better (much better!) photos of the rifle. Unfortunately I did not print out this discussion so I may not have collected all the information needed to follow-up on the topics discussed above. Unforunately there is not any internet (cell phone or otherwise) where the rifles are! (You need to *Login* to view media files and links) Next time I will do the cleaning rod test to confirm the exact length of the barrel. (External measurement shows 22 inches) And yes, the SN's 1st number does appear to be a 3 and not 8 No "c" is stamped on the rear sight. Once again thanks for all the information!


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butlersrangers KCA Forum Member Offline Krag Enthusiast! Posts: 6330 Location: Michigan Bi-Peninsular&Proud Joined: Oct 7^th, 2009	Re: Correcting an appraisal done on 1899 Carbine Reply #6 - Jan 18^th, 2017 at 7:52pm	Print Post
	'mcoulter' - That is a replacement barrel that is made from a shortened Krag rifle barrel. The rear-sight is a 1901 Krag rifle sight. IMHO - The barrel will actually prove to be a little more than 22 inches long. (22&1/2" to 22&3/4" - is my estimate from the photo). The 1905 Springfield front-sight installation and muzzle crown were nicely done, but, not likely at Springfield or Benicia. This Krag's best asset is its very nice model 1899 carbine stock. My appraisal would be $550 to $700, but, it would not be in great demand, these days.
	« Last Edit: Jan 19^th, 2017 at 6:34pm by butlersrangers »

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mcoulter KCA Forum Member Offline Krag Enthusiast! Posts: 4 Joined: Jan 12^th, 2017	Re: Correcting an appraisal done on 1899 Carbine Reply #7 - Jan 20^th, 2017 at 5:51pm	Print Post
	butlersrangers wrote on Jan 18^th, 2017 at 7:52pm: 'mcoulter' - That is a replacement barrel that is made from a shortened Krag rifle barrel. The rear-sight is a 1901 Krag rifle sight. IMHO - The barrel will actually prove to be a little more than 22 inches long. (22&1/2" to 22&3/4" - is my estimate from the photo). The 1905 Springfield front-sight installation and muzzle crown were nicely done, but, not likely at Springfield or Benicia. This Krag's best asset is its very nice model 1899 carbine stock. My appraisal would be $550 to $700, but, it would not be in great demand, these days. Thank you very much for that additional information!


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