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New Krag. Any details that I'm missing (Read 7770 times)
bullets
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New Krag. Any details that I'm missing
Mar 16th, 2015 at 8:03pm
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Picked up an 1899 carbine today for about $300.  seems to me that that is going price for one in this condition.

from what I can tell, it's a sporterized carbine, missing top hand guard, with added sling mounts, and the front sight has been changed out.  Anything that I'm missing?

pics to follow

thanks!
  
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bullets
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Re: New Krag. Any details that I'm missing
Reply #1 - Mar 16th, 2015 at 8:03pm
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pics:

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Re: New Krag. Any details that I'm missing
Reply #2 - Mar 16th, 2015 at 8:17pm
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Small backstory on why I bought this.

My stepdad had a Krag that was his father's rifle.   His dad died when he was young, and his mom had to sell off a lot of his possessions to make ends meet, so he doesn't have a whole lot in the way of heirlooms from his dad.  Unfortunately, my stepdad's brother got addicted to drugs in the 80s, and stole the rifle and sold it.

He wasn't really a gun guy then, so he didn't really have any details of what it was, other than a 30-40 krag(he still has a couple boxes of ammo) 

Now that he is into guns, he talks about it regularly, saying that he'd like to find one some day. Well this one popped up today on a local classified. I know it's not an original, and not very valuable, but frankly, a $1000+ krag is out of the budget.  So this will finally be a replacement for that gun.
  
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psteinmayer
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Re: New Krag. Any details that I'm missing
Reply #3 - Mar 16th, 2015 at 10:06pm
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Hi Bullets.

A carbine marked 1899 started out as a true carbine, so I'm perplexed as to why the 1903 banded front sight.  Did it have a rifle barrel installed and then cut down?  What is the length of the barrel as measured from the muzzle to the closed bolt face?  A carbine barrel should be exactly 22 inches.  Also, that banded front sight is installed backwards - the ramp should taper towards the muzzle with the sharp edge towards the receiver. 

I'm curious about the rear sight too.  It's a 1902 model.  Based on the height of the ramp, I would guess it's a rifle sight.  Is there a C stamped on the side of the ramp?

It could be restored to a full military carbine if you were interested in a replacement handguard, and a replacement carbine barrel.
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: New Krag. Any details that I'm missing
Reply #4 - Mar 16th, 2015 at 11:09pm
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"Bullets":  Welcome to the KCA Forum.

  Psteinmayer brought up most of the relevant points.  Your Krag certainly started life as a Model 1899 carbine.  I have a similar one, that someone installed a cut-down rifle barrel with a banded front-sight, probably to have a mint bore.  It is my favorite Krag for shooting.  I hope yours has a really nice bore!

  Your Stock is an 1899 carbine stock that someone has thinned down so that it no longer has 'finger grooves'.  People liked thin stocks in the old days.  The barrel-band has also been moved rearward.  A hand-guard will not look or fit right with the wood alterations.  The rear sight is a 1902 rifle sight.

  This Krag is worth $300 IMHO.  If it were mine, I would just take the 1903 front sight off and turn it around.  I would patch the 'splintered' forearm tip and move the barrel-band forward against the band-spring.  (A discrete Stock cross-pin, located behind the band, would keep it in position).

  This is a useful Krag adapted for 'hunting', as countless Krags were.  It should make your Step-Dad happy!  Be a Good Son and take him Krag Shooting. 
« Last Edit: Mar 17th, 2015 at 12:11pm by butlersrangers »  
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bullets
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Re: New Krag. Any details that I'm missing
Reply #5 - Mar 17th, 2015 at 12:38pm
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psteinmayer wrote on Mar 16th, 2015 at 10:06pm:
Hi Bullets.

A carbine marked 1899 started out as a true carbine, so I'm perplexed as to why the 1903 banded front sight.  Did it have a rifle barrel installed and then cut down?  What is the length of the barrel as measured from the muzzle to the closed bolt face?  A carbine barrel should be exactly 22 inches.  Also, that banded front sight is installed backwards - the ramp should taper towards the muzzle with the sharp edge towards the receiver. 

I'm curious about the rear sight too.  It's a 1902 model.  Based on the height of the ramp, I would guess it's a rifle sight.  Is there a C stamped on the side of the ramp?

It could be restored to a full military carbine if you were interested in a replacement handguard, and a replacement carbine barrel.


Thanks! 

The sight puzzled me as well.  The barrel does indeed measure 22" from closed bolt.  Perhaps there was sight damage, or maybe someone just wanted a fresh barrel, or a smith somewhere was just doing batch work, and made all of his guns the same, or maybe it was a sight height issue with the modified rear sight? 

The barrel does have a relatively shiny, bright bore for a 120 year old rifle. It's in need of a good cleaning, and it's looking like after being cleaned the bore is going to really pop.  Im thinking the whole rifle could use a good cleaning, so I will probably wait until I give it to him and pull the action out of the stock and give it a thorough once over.

As far as the rear sight, there are no stamps on the side.  The only marking is a small "Z" on the rear of the sight base, visible when the ladder is flipped up.

Butler - Thank you as well.  I noticed the "thinned" that you mentioned.  Not sure how visible it is in the pictures, but there's still remnants of the finger grooves on the forearm. 

The front sight, how would I remove and reinstall?  Is it just press-fit?

character limit, continued....
  
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Re: New Krag. Any details that I'm missing
Reply #6 - Mar 17th, 2015 at 12:54pm
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Regarding the barrel band, just looking at it quickly, it seems like with the forearm being smaller/narrower forward of the band, it wouldn't fit there (too big of diameter) without the top wood?

This rifle will definitely be shot again by the weekend!  It's sat in the back of the previous owner's safe(told me he got it from his father in law) for 25 years, so it's begging to be used again.

Thank you both for your input. 

One last thing - This just popped up on a local forum: 
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I just sent the guy a message asking if he will ship. I'd like to have one box for my stepdad for the novelty/vintage factor.  Does this stuff have any value for Krag collectors?  If so, and if the guy on that forum is willing to ship, I will gladly buy all three boxes, and ship two out to one or two members here for actual cost + shipping.  If not, that seems about the going rate for new ammo, so the other boxes might just get shot.
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: New Krag. Any details that I'm missing
Reply #7 - Mar 17th, 2015 at 2:32pm
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The 1903 banded sight base is held in place by the cross-pin.  If you remove the pin, the base can be driven forward off the barrel.  There may be a loose spline that holds the base from turning and locks it in place.  The spline is held in place by the cross pin.

I would suggest you remove the rear sling-swivel from the stock and plug the screw holes.  If you remove the front swivel from the Rifle barrel-band, the band can be more tightly clamped in its proper place on the stock.  (Another option is to build up the stock, where the band seats, with glass-bedding).  The hand-guard plays no role in tensioning the barrel band.

(photo shows forearm 'shoulder' that keeps barrel-band in position against band-spring).

  
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Re: New Krag. Any details that I'm missing
Reply #8 - Mar 17th, 2015 at 6:02pm
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Springfield 1905 front-sight detail:

(Since your front sight was put on backwards, you may have to file a new 'slot' for the retaining cross-pin, if you turn the base around).
« Last Edit: Mar 17th, 2015 at 8:51pm by butlersrangers »  
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