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 25 Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show (Read 8787 times)
butlersrangers
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #15 - Mar 19th, 2019 at 4:10pm
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FWIW - Many of the arsenal 'refurbished' model 1896 Krags seem to have model 1901 or 1902 rear-sights, higher .413" front-blade, and model 1898 bolts.

If arsenal rebuilt or 'refurbished', "Baltimoreed's" Krag was likely done before these 'improved' parts came into use. (... or when it no longer mattered)?

IMHO - He has a good SAW service specimen.

Has anyone checked #83470 against SRS data? (I'm not in position to, right now).

His model 1896 was likely (originally) built, between November, 1897 and January, 1898.
  
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Local Boy
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #16 - Mar 19th, 2019 at 4:19pm
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Not listed in 'Serial Numbers of Known U.S. Krags.'

Poyer's has it produced on December 1897.
  
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Baltimoreed
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #17 - Mar 19th, 2019 at 5:48pm
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Surprise! Removed the buttplate and found a 3 pc cleaning rod and an oiler! Neat. Here’s what the hardware looks like.

Did a quick search and the rods and oiler are worth about $50.00.
« Last Edit: Mar 20th, 2019 at 2:24am by Baltimoreed »  
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Baltimoreed
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #18 - Mar 19th, 2019 at 6:18pm
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The 1896 cartouche and proof with a V after more cleaning.
  
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Local Boy
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #19 - Mar 19th, 2019 at 6:50pm
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Dang...I don't know...looks too good to be a refurb?

Maybe it was manufactured...stuck in a closet...and long forgotten?

or maybe it's a Chinese Norinco/Inland import copycat Krag. Roll Eyes
  
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Baltimoreed
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #20 - Mar 19th, 2019 at 7:19pm
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My theory is that- ‘as’ the gun had nasty cosmoline in the action, bolt, rear sight, etc, hard to reach places and residues on the dark stock, it had been something bought by the seller in an estate sale so he didn’t have much in it. With the big ‘only once a year’ Balt show coming up he or a helper wiped the worst off and he put it on his overflow table as opposed to his high dollar table. As gunked up as it was he priced it to sell along with 2 other krag rifles on the same table. They were 100 and 200 dollars more with no cosmo but had sanded stocks. The guy tending the table told me that they were priced low to sell and even knocked 45.00 off the price on the tag. Just my theory and I’m stickin to it. I don’t think that it’s been reanythinged. It was wrapped in cosmo until he wiped it down and I cleaned it some more. Even a blind squirrel finds an acorn once in awhile.
« Last Edit: Mar 20th, 2019 at 2:05pm by Baltimoreed »  
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Local Boy
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #21 - Mar 19th, 2019 at 8:16pm
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Reading Knutes recent posting of 'Too Many Krags-What To Do?'...

Gen. Crozier mentions to the Army Appropriations Committee that surplus Krags were being sold as, 'never used', for $6.00.

They were being sold for 'the promotion of target practice.'

So I think your theory is very plausible...just saying.

But whatever the circumstance...you still have a very, very nice Krag!
  
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Baltimoreed
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #22 - Mar 20th, 2019 at 12:18am
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Two more things that I initially thought odd about my rifle until I checked my Poyer book, the bright blue extractor [ I’ll take a better pix tomorrow, it’s crazy blue] and the case hardened buttplate cap. Neat details for a military arm.
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #23 - Mar 20th, 2019 at 1:27am
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Stock 'Acceptance Cartouche' date is 1896. Rifle's serial number indicates manufacture between November, 1897, and January, 1898.


This indicates 'Baltimoreed's" very nice Krag is not wearing its original stock.

Metal finishes and wood appearance are consistent with arsenal procedures specified to bring arms to acceptable condition for 're-issue'.

Most arms used in Cuba and Philippines during SAW would require being refurbished.

IMHO - This is all credible and good.
  
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #24 - Mar 20th, 2019 at 4:56am
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It may be worth noting here that the original finish on US Krag receivers and loading gates was not "blued" ("browned" in period terminology) but rather a mottled gray/black resulting from the oil quench after case-hardening. The more uniform blue-black finish seen in some photos on this thread is arguably the result of re-finishing, likely done at the arsenal sometime before being retired from active service. A good photo of the receiver's left side could help determine which finish is present.
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #25 - Mar 20th, 2019 at 12:24pm
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"Baltimoreed's" - New Krag also has a 'slotted' front barrel-band/nose-cap. This was likely put on during the arsenal 'rebuild' process.

The original front band would have been 'un-slotted'.
  
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #26 - Mar 21st, 2019 at 9:10am
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It's always easy to be an armchair critic of beautiful pieces like this Krag we are examining with a fine-toothed comb. But, that cartouche stamp doesn't look authentic to me. It just seems to be too clean and deep. I would lean towards a re-stamping of some sort but not from SA.

But, I could be wrong.

Thanks again for giving us something to talk about. We all love nice Krags like yours.
  
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Baltimoreed
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #27 - Mar 21st, 2019 at 3:04pm
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Here’s some outside shots. Cleaned it with simple green and 1/2 turpentine and BLO. Needed a sling to complete the look. Next job will be to build some loads. It won’t chamber my Constabulary rifle loads which are neck sized only after firing in the PC rifle but it will chamber fl sized brass just fine.
  
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butlersrangers
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #28 - Mar 21st, 2019 at 3:48pm
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'Baltimoreed' - Boy, I'm glad the seller came down $45 on this wreck!  Grin

A truly fine looking Krag. I'm glad you were able to see past the heavy coat of cosmoline.

FWIW - I don't doubt the authenticity of your cartouche and script "P" stamps. Some 'J.S.A. cartouche' examples show rounded, rather than beveled, corners. There is a faint hint of a 'ghost cartouche' where the Die may have bounced after the cartouche was originally struck.

(The small "V" is a stocker or sub-inspector mark).

During the 'rebuild - process' stocks were scraped and lightly sanded to remove nicks and minor blemishes. That would explain any light areas of the J.S.A. initials.
(The box outline and circle outline may have been cleaned up and traced a bit, with a pick or metal brush).

Your forearm's 'finger grooves' look very crisp. The 'flame blue' of your extractor is correct.

BTW - The 'slotted' front-band was adopted in 1900. This might be a clue as to when your Krag was likely 'refreshed'.
  
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madsenshooter
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Re: Found a winner at the Md Antique Military Show
Reply #29 - Mar 21st, 2019 at 9:27pm
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I see the remnants of an older cartouche beneath the 1896 cartouche.  Slightly left and lower.  Nice original sling, lets me see the differences between it a repros.
  
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