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Criterion Barrels (Read 10972 times)
S99VG
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #30 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 3:08pm
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So it sounds like a long shot successfully salvaging a front sight off a stub.
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FredC
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #31 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 4:23pm
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I hardly throw away any piece of metal, when I do I usually regret it. I figured there were others like me out there. I shortened a Krag barrel from about 24' to 18 plus a little and kept the stub, who knows when I might need to replace a 30 caliber pistol barrel some day?
Figured a little heat and you could slide the base out sideways with no damage. Maybe it is not that easy.
The Criterion base in BR's photo would look right from a distance even though it is not a perfect replica.
BR, I went back and looked at your post number 10 in this thread, that front sight base looks to me like it is dovetailed. Is it me or an optical delusion?
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butlersrangers
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #32 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 4:29pm
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I think bronze-brazing as done by SA holds pretty good.
If I were trying to recycle a Krag front-sight base, I'd be inclined to cut it out of the barrel and file or grind off surrounding metal.
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Last Edit: May 23
rd
, 2020 at 3:29pm by
butlersrangers
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FredC
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #33 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 4:39pm
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butlersrangers wrote
on May 22
nd
, 2020 at 4:29pm:
I'm inclined to think bronze-brazing as done by SA holds pretty good.
If I were trying to recycle a Krag front-sight base, I'd be inclined to cut and file or grind.
Had not even thought of that, hold the base in a vice and mill the barrel away. Only scrap about an inch of barrel that way. I do not really like torches anyway.
BR I added a question in my previous post. Is that a criterion base on #10, is it dovetailed?
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butlersrangers
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #34 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 5:15pm
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I do not believe Criterion makes a Krag front-sight base.
I saved pictures of some repro-sight examples, I have seen over the years.
I believe both of these photos show an S&S Firearms replica base attached to a barrel.
I am not certain of the origin of the first barrel. It appears 'dove-tailed' and maybe poorly brazed or soldered.
The second photo is a Criterion barrel. Criterion seems to leave a 'flat' to locate the front-sight in relation to the rear-sight holes.
I'm not certain if the base is dovetailed, as well as, brazed or silver soldered.
The owner had to send it back for a re-do, since the base fell off, the first time.
It seems to me, more could be done with the S&S base/flange to blend it in with the barrel contour?
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Last Edit: May 23
rd
, 2020 at 3:32pm by
butlersrangers
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S99VG
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #35 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 5:20pm
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I'm thinking the front sights sold by SS have enough meat to dress them down to the barrel contour. And after sweating it in one should be able to come up with something close to what the armory would have produced. The question I have now is would it be best to solder the base on first then dress it down or do it the other way. That is file the base round and then soldering it in place. If I did that I would be sure to clamp the base into the dovetail. However, either way looks like it would require re-bluing the barrel to make a clean presentation.
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Last Edit: May 22
nd
, 2020 at 9:35pm by
S99VG
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S99VG
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #36 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 5:25pm
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FYI - I also have this question posted on the CMP site:
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As a matter of fact, I started it over there and was advised to post it on this forum. I did receive a good answer on the CMP forum. If you take a look, it is at the current end of the thread.
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butlersrangers
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #37 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 6:09pm
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I have only seen Criterion barrels on internet sites. I don't own one, nor have I seen one in person.
Criterion barrels are in the 'white'.
CMP jobs are left in the 'White'. I believe they will install sights, if provided.
If they send barrel out for 'bluing', the action gets blued, too.
It's nice to have the CMP option. I'm sure customer satisfaction varies.
It would be nice to have a craftsman who currently specializes in Krag re-barreling.
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mavt
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #38 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 6:44pm
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I just picked up sporter 456713 from a local gunsmith after having the barrel shortened and d/t for a regular dovetailed sight base as the solution for the overturned barrel/crooked front sight. I saved the Criterion stub with the S&S sight base attached that is in the picture BR posted above. I'll take a few close up pics of it then I'll try to remove it. Curious how effective the installation was after having the first attempt fail.
Criterion mills a flat to locate the front sight. It has a very slight dovetail and appears to be there only to guide placement while attaching. Holding it up to a light there is a very small gap between the front and rear of the base and dovetail and the dovetail doesn't blend completely with the base edges either. Someone in the CMP link the OP posted said you have to be careful with l/r position when attaching the base but I don't see any measurable excess flat on either side to have to center it between. The S&S base appears to very closely match the flat width...at least on this example.
I will get pictures up asap - going to the range to try out the new sight configuration.
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Mark_Daiute
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #39 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 7:42pm
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strange the things we do. I picked up the last 5 inches of a Krag barrel with the front sight base on it, at a gunshow for 5 bucks. It's in a bag with all my Krag parts.
Enjoy your weekend!
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mavt
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #40 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 9:35pm
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Why go away for a holiday weekend when you can stay home and look at Krag sight pictures?
Here are a couple backgrounds and some different angles of the S&S base on a Criterion barrel stub.
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mavt
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #41 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 9:39pm
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And a few more with two showing the small gap front and back between base and the shallow dovetail cut.
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S99VG
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #42 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 10:26pm
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So it appears the SS front sight is a loose fit in the Criterion dovetail - which might not really be a true dovetail in the first place. But instead just a flat for "positioning" the sight.
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mavt
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #43 -
May 22
nd
, 2020 at 11:53pm
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Definitely not a working dovetail.
Put it in a vise between boards and gave it several good raps and it didn't budge.
Didn't take much with a mapp gas torch to separate them. Looks like a silver solder applied on both pieces then combined and heated again but others may know better about this process.
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butlersrangers
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Re: Criterion Barrels
Reply #44 -
May 23
rd
, 2020 at 12:28am
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FWIW - It appears the silver-solder joint was strong enough for our purposes.
IMHO - The S&S front-sight base would give a better appearance if the 'flange and dove-tail' idea was dispensed with.
The bottom of the sight base could be ground 'concave' to match the radius of the Krag barrel, near the muzzle.
This would facilitate placement for soft or silver-soldering, give more bonding surface, and better replicate original appearance.
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