More pictures

more pictures

'Whig' - FWIW - That is a nice little Krag with a real model 1899 carbine action and barrel.

I believe the front barrel-band is not legit for an Armory made 'school rifle'. It is very poorly fitted to the stock tip, unlike Armory work, which is finely done. It also lacks the correct shape bayonet lug.

A correct "School Rifle" front band would have been stretched with a press and arbor to fit the larger diameter, at the 'muzzle area', of a carbine barrel.

You have a pretty nice Arm, but, I think this combination has been put together in the civilian market.

I would like to see a picture of your 1902 rear sight with the leaf 'up' so that the spring is visible.

The tip and fill work are definitely not up to snuff. The lug bevel is not widely known, but remember, this arm was meant to use the long M1903 bayonet, NOT that of the Krag, which has a different latch hook actuation. The bevel makes attachment of the correct bayonet easier, and is one of the little points to check for - though not all legit specimens have it.

The most desirable cartouche for a school gun is the small-boxed JFC, not the normal Krag "JSA/date" style.

That all said, they were secondary pieces, not all done at SA, but all done at a time period when ANY stock date would have been available. The 98/99 date overstrike is interesting but I believe it is only on the SG by accident or coincidence.

That appears to be an 1898C base with a 1902 leaf, since the rails are so low.

I second Chuck's (BR's) opinion that this piece has some "issues" and is likely not a proper collector-grade piece. Sorry.

I have never owned a 'Philippine Constabulary rifle' or a 'School Rifle'. I am not sure I have ever seen or handled a REAL one. I have seen obvious fakes.

I learned as a young collector, a lot of Krag cut-downs were being passed off as PC Carbines. Nobody was even talking about 'School Rifles'. It is likely only two PC Rifles have survived. Over 1,400 'School Rifles' were sold to academies by the Government, so some are out there.

'Hey Joes' Short Krag is about as convincing a candidate as I have seen posted here. The most suspicious thing about it to me is that it has a model 1898 carbine rear-sight on it.

'Whigs' Short Krag has an obvious standard Krag front barrel-band on it and shows a very crude wood and metal fit at the stock tip. A correct band would fit the wood and metal contours with near perfection.

Interestingly, both Hey Joe and Whig appear to have similar 'cartouche' stamps on their Krags. (I don't really think the worn marking is 'MOD', for Manila Ordnance Depot, unless someone in the past engaged in fakery).

Whig's serial number, 225798, is an early model 1899 carbine number. Northwestern Military Academy purchased 120 School Rifles, including #225627 & 225901. Since Whig's number does not appear in Mallory's SRS Data, it is not likely Whig's Krag went to NWMA.

#225798 was assembled around September, 1899. It is in the range of carbines and rifles that were made with the 'headless cocking piece, (202,000 to 285,000 - per Mallory).

Attached photos: 1. Whig's barrel-band does not fit barrel contour, like a correct band should. 2. Krag Constabulary band.

I didn't realize I had one of those rare 1902 Carbine sights. Thanks for the good news!

What should I do with this carbine? Is there any chance a real school carbine front band is available to fit on this? Or should I just leave it as is?

How much is this 1902 Carbine sight worth by itself?

Those pictures I've seen and examined closely before but they don't look any different from mine. I still don't know what an authentic front band should look like on a school rifle because the pictures are all bad.

Thanks.

I appreciate all the help. I still am at a loss as to the exact changes in the front band that would need to be made to fit correctly as with an official school barrel band like the one Grandpa's gun parts had for sale.

Does anyone have a real school carbine that can take good pictures and dimensions for me to replicate? Did someone here buy that one from Grandpa's gun parts? I'd like to find someone who has one for me to try to alter or someone who could alter one properly.

Otherwise, I'll just leave it alone and watch for an available band in the future. It's a nice carbine overall anyway. I'd like to know more about what the second Cartouche is also.